In the Apollo Sanctum, Alex claims that he'll handle Blados and Chalis while Matthew triggers the Lens... then the two turn up and wonder if they should have stalled for longer. Which means there's three options I can see here:
1)Alex was just baiting Matthew into trying to light the lens for some reason and the whole scene before hand was an act. Supported by the fact that Blados and Chalis aren't weakened by their battle with Alex (unless he restored them after beating them for some reason)
2)Alex lost, which seems unlikely unless Punish inflicted Instant Death on him...
3)They teleported to completely different places, since there's no way that any of them knew where the others were going and by the time Alex realised, you were already battling.
Oh, or 4) Camelot forgot the perfectly reasonable explanation they had for this happening.
...Didn't we already discuss this? Or am I thinking of a discussion from the Temple?
I'm not sure. If it was talked about, it was not to do with the titles anyway...
It sounds like something we talked about, but i'm not sure...
Quote1)Alex was just baiting Matthew into trying to light the lens for some reason and the whole scene before hand was an act. Supported by the fact that Blados and Chalis aren't weakened by their battle with Alex (unless he restored them after beating them for some reason)
well if you remember what happened at the Jupiter light house... he healed Felix and party, so they could help Isaac and he was an enemy. also sure there was more behind it, but the point is, Alex has a habit of healing people when he is suppose to fight them...
At Jupiter, Alex mainly wanted to save Mia, which was shown if you mind read him I think.
I suppose he could have wanted to keep Rief safe, but somehow I can't see that happening.
It might be more likely he'd want to protect Amiti than Rief.
Aye, Amiti *IS* his son, after all.
But according to what Camelot has in store, does he know this?
Near the end, he has his suspicions. Talk/Mind Read him.
Jiten. PLAY THE GAMES. This really isn't something you can contribute to if you don't understand the context.
She has you there, Jiten. Go play the games, and then come back.
I think he's played the GBA games, just not DD. However, this is a DD discussion, so he'll be expected to know the content.
The problem isn't that DD has plotholes, it's just that the plot itself pretty much sucks.
Still, I'd like you to not comment on that which you have no experience in. It doesn't tend to go over well. Trust me, I once tried to talk Fire Emblem. Made a fool of myself back then. As such, I'd rather not see anyone else do that mistake, so...
Seriously, play the game first. Also, get a legit copy already. The DS lifecycle is nearly done, why don't you have one?
@Role: Well, I know the basic mechanics behind Fire Emblem, and my grasp of strategy is fairly good — not amazing, but definitely good enough. Despite this, I tend to roleplay the game a bit too much, rather than playing just from a tactics standpoint. As such, if I tried to talk Fire Emblem with the pros, I'd definitely make a fool of my self as well.
Jamie, I was referring to a specific event here. You're not helping.
Heh, true. I'll stop.
Hmm... how do we know Dark Dawn's plot sucks?
Compare TBS with TLA. If you had TBS's plot on its own it would suck pretty badly; follow the bad guys and try to stop them destroying the world. Generic, rather dull and - when you think about it - not even as interested as DD's plot.
What if the plot behind DD has been carefully set up for GS4; written less with the actual game and more future games in mind. Knowing where you're going to end can work quite well, as proved by JK Rowling's Harry Potter, but what if Camelot fall just a bit short of her talent? The story as a whole might even be better than TBS+TLA's, but DD's suffered on its own as a result.
Personally, given that the first 2 were successful, I wouldn't be surprised if they were trying the same idea of really connecting the plots of 2 - or maybe more - of the games. Therefore I will reserve judgement until I see either GS4 or proof that it's not going to happen.
Quote from: Awec on 19, November, 2011, 06:20:27 AM
Hmm... how do we know Dark Dawn's plot sucks?
...Is this a philosophical question? Kinda like "How do you know you're not just a butterfly dreaming that you're human?" Because I'd have assumed that the majority of the fandom hating the story would kind of qualify it of having a sucky plot.
They're just hatin'. Kinda like Gen wunners in Pokémon. I mean, really. Go back and play TBS by itself with a clean slate. Ignore everything you know about the second game, and go back and play it. You might find you agree with Awec.
What Awec says might be true, but there is a better way to tell; what the majority believes. What do most of the ratings say for the first game? If they have gone up, what were they when the game came out? What about Dark Dawn's ratings?
But this is kind of off topic. To continue on with this whole Alex thing, I wouldn't be surprised at this point if they ended up making him related to all of the main characters because of the Golden Sun rising event thing.
Jiten... ugg... if you think about it, golden sun is basically about Alex... He is the one and only main antagonist... not only will he live forever, he has 3/4 of the golden sun's power... they really don't have a GS 3 and 4 with out him... other wise there really wasn't much point to what you saw at the end of TLA.
Technically, Isaac only got a fragment of Mars, so Alex has maybe 15/16 of the Golden Sun.
And Jiten, you can't just eliminate a main antagonist for no reason at all.
Quote from: Awec on 19, November, 2011, 06:20:27 AM
Hmm... how do we know Dark Dawn's plot sucks?
Compare TBS with TLA. If you had TBS's plot on its own it would suck pretty badly; follow the bad guys and try to stop them destroying the world. Generic, rather dull and - when you think about it - not even as interested as DD's plot.
What if the plot behind DD has been carefully set up for GS4; written less with the actual game and more future games in mind. Knowing where you're going to end can work quite well, as proved by JK Rowling's Harry Potter, but what if Camelot fall just a bit short of her talent? The story as a whole might even be better than TBS+TLA's, but DD's suffered on its own as a result.
Personally, given that the first 2 were successful, I wouldn't be surprised if they were trying the same idea of really connecting the plots of 2 - or maybe more - of the games. Therefore I will reserve judgement until I see either GS4 or proof that it's not going to happen.
I think that DD's plot was bad (not sucked until I finish the sequel) for a few reasons.
1: TBS introduced almost the entire second party. In DD, the new Felix is going to be a completely new character, and regardless of peoples' feelings on Felix, al least he was in some way related to the plot in both games.
2: It disregarded a lot of the old canon. The city of the Anemos became the moon after they sealed Alchemy. The ancients sealed alchemy to stop their experiments. The ancients experimented with light and dark, culminating in the Luna tower, which is triggered by eclipses. Therefore, the ancients began attempting to control darkness and light after they sealed alchemy. Also, the werewolves of Garoh were replaced by weird beast things.
3: Cold and Dark is EVIL! Therefore Rief, who uses the cold, is EVIL! Hopefully they'll say Isaac was over-simplifying.
4: Saturos and Menardi were sinister. Blados and Chalis were just 'Oh, it's
those guys again.'
Quote from: Jiten on 20, November, 2011, 06:05:34 PM
I do remember watching the ending of Golden Sun 2, all I can think of at the moment is this: Either Camelot, will completely disregard Alex or Golden Sun and move on to something else and not return for an unknown period of time, or pickup the story again and split it amongst a game or two, depending on how they feel the game should go. The only thing they could do is: completely disregard what happened with Alex and when (or if) Golden Sun 4 Comes out, it could either end abruptly without a logical amount of explanation pertaining to him and his motives and what his plans were and whether they took effect or just dropped off completely. It depends on the companies thoughts about it, and whether they want him in the next game or not.
Jiten... please. I beg of you. Just.... stop. Your posts are getting painful to read.
@Role: If you don't mind me saying, I would express the opinion that Jiten's posts have been painful to read since he first joined. It's why I still think English isn't his first language.
@Durza: Whenever I saw Blados and Chalis, my thoughts went something along the lines of "F*** you, Chalis. F*** you. And while we're on the subject, Blados, take your cocky attitude and shove it."
QuoteAnd while we're on the subject, Blados, take your cocky attitude and shove it."
He can't even back his attitude up, he's a joke of a boss. \( ﾟヮﾟ)/
Agatio & Karst, now THAT was a boss fight. Pure awesome.
That's not it, Jamie. He keeps commenting on things he has no experience with. Trying to figure out what he's saying or implying when he lacks the context to say or imply it is kind of... frustrating.
For here, I have no idea what the hell he's trying to say. At first he goes "I wonder if they'll ignore alex and the golden sun", to which I stomp my foot and scream "DARK FREAKING DAWN!", yet at the same time, he says something along the lines of that being done in GS4 or something, while having to read what I swear is damn close to legalese it's so confusing, I have to just stop and go:
"What the hell are you trying to even say?"
I think it'd be a lot better if he'd stop commenting on Dark Dawn stuff alltogether, since every time he gets into a conversation that requires knowledge of Dark Dawn, it just causes me headaches.
Jiten, it'd probably be better to think what your trying to say through thoroughly before posting it. There's no reason to stop altogether as long as you learn from past mistakes.
Quote from: MegaDarkNero on 21, November, 2011, 01:07:54 PM
QuoteAnd while we're on the subject, Blados, take your cocky attitude and shove it."
He can't even back his attitude up, he's a joke of a boss. \( ﾟヮﾟ)/
I found his instant deaths tended to work at the most annoying of times though.
QuoteAgatio & Karst, now THAT was a boss fight. Pure awesome.
I remember the first time I fought them. I was thinking 'They can't fight me, I've only got two party members' the whole time.
It's hard to make a point when we can't even figure out what you're talking about, Jiten.
Can't be much more useless than a post saying you're not going to explain in fairness...
@Role: My point was that Jiten speaks broken Legalese ALL the time!
@MDN: Agreed. Blados and Chalis were FAR too easy. At least give them more unleashes! I have trouble believing that Punish and Scornful Caress or whatever are their ONLY weapon unleashes. Give them Spin Strike or Foul Saw or Sunset Burst or something! I think Blados should've had Sunset Burst and/or Zenith Strike, Punish should've been slowed down slightly so you can actually see what happens, and Chalis should've been given Foul Saw and/or Crimson Cut. Maybe also give them a "Dark Hold" or something, that works like Agatio's Cage.
I think them having an altering strategy as they get weaker would have been pretty cool as well. But nope...
:P
GS:DD was too easy in general and I think that the bosses should have been amped up quite a bit. The only ones I remember being any fair amount of difficulty were the Mountain Roc and the Chaos Chimera, but the latter didn't even use Djinn Storm on me for god knows why, so yeah. :p Also, I was fairly disappointed that Alex managed to screw off once again, not fighting us. I mean, it makes sense in the first 2 titles, but doesn't he not want the Apollo Lens to be activated? Maybe I'm missing something, but this time it felt less of a ruse and more like he's a weak coward. :p
QuoteI remember the first time I fought them. I was thinking 'They can't fight me, I've only got two party members' the whole time.
I think you mean Saturos/Menardi...
Didn't the Chaos Chimera start using stronger and stronger attacks the lower you got its health down? I wish we could apply that to all bosses, you know? That's how it should be done.
Quote from: Role on 22, November, 2011, 03:35:38 PM
Didn't the Chaos Chimera start using stronger and stronger attacks the lower you got its health down? I wish we could apply that to all bosses, you know? That's how it should be done.
Didn't the Doom Dragon do that aswell?
No, the Doom Dragon is actually three monsters you fight in a row, each with different movesets, at least as far as the code is concerned.
I think the Chimaera had two stages of health regen and swapped between Djinn Blast and Djinn Storm when it was below half health. It also had a signature move for above half and below. I don't think it'd be possible to code that for the GBA system though. Doom Dragon also seems like a better way of avoiding summon rushes.
Quote from: Charon the Ferryman on 22, November, 2011, 02:14:03 PMQuoteI remember the first time I fought them. I was thinking 'They can't fight me, I've only got two party members' the whole time.
I think you mean Saturos/Menardi...
No, on top of Jupiter Lighthouse. I kept wondering why the other two hadn't run up the stairs yet when the bad guys started threatening to kill me.