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 1 
 on: Today at 07:55:09 AM 
Started by DevAnj - Last post by DevAnj
Alright, it's time to move on!



Though we are in the overworld, we can really only go to one other place at the moment - this cave. Let's just do it.



Cave of Spirits
Walking just a few steps into the cave leads to our first encounter.. and it's a scripted one too!

Battle 1
So a quick rundown of combat actions: we can pick between Fight, Tactics and Run. Fight brings up a submenu of options, Tactics allows you to choose between a bunch of auto combat modes or manual battle, and Run does what you think it would. Currently we don't have Tactics because we only control Artur, and always have to issue commands to him.

As for Fight's submenu, it provides options to Attack, use Magic, Defend, or use Item(s). If you've played any RPG, odds are you know what all of these commands do. Honestly, even if you haven't, they're fairly self explanatory.

Given that this is the early game, Artur doesn't really have any options besides Attacking or Using items to heal.

This particular fight goes fairly trivially, and gives equally trivial rewards.



Quote
Artur: Huh?!(Rejoice, the presumably silent character spoke!)
Annie: I came anyway!
Steiner: Oh... It's Annie.
Annie: "Oh... It's Annie." What kind of greeting is that?!
Steiner: Annie, why are you here? You're not thinking about going with us, are you?(Wow, Steiner really doesn't like Annie being here)
Annie: Why, Steiner?!
Annie: Do you think I would be a nuisance if I came along?!
Steiner makes a head shaking motion with his body, as if to say no
Annie: Do you feel the same way, Artur?
Artur also does a head shaking motion, except with his, well, head
Annie: Really??? Are you sure?? I won't be in the way?
Both Steiner and Artur proceed to perform the head shaking motions they did before
Annie: But maybe I shouldn't... I'm just a weak girl... I wouldn't want to hinder your journey.
Annie: If I get in your way, then you won't be able to do the favor for my father.
Artur nods his head(This seems like a dumb thing to do, and it contradicts all the fervent head shaking so far. So does Artur want Annie on the journey or not?)
Annie: Hah! I knew that's how you felt! Just like every other MAN!
Annie quickly moves upto Artur
Annie: You think you're so strong that you don't need a woman's hand, huh?!(Oh I see, she's going to act like a spoiled brat in response to Artur's poor gesturing. That's cool.)
Annie: Hmph, I'm not so easily scorned.
Annie: I'm the daughter of the kingdom's top knight & I have been trained to fight.
Annie shoves Artur aside and then proceeds to move deeper into the cave
Steiner: Annie! Where are you going?
Annie moves deeper into the cave, then turns around
Annie: Where I go doesn't concern the two of you.
Annie: When I get the Spirit Water, maybe you'll respect me then.
Steiner: We're in trouble, Artur! This place is dangerous. We must stop Annie.

Of course, trust this game to open the very first dungeon with DRAMA.

Heading deeper into the cave ourselves leads to more scripted fights, where Artur can still only choose between Attacking and Using Items. Not worth covering.
What is worth covering is the way this game does attacks and counter attacks.

You see, when you decide to attack a target, the game chooses between a regular attack or a critical hit. Occasionally, it will let you execute a second attack, which again can be a regular hit or a critical hit. So you have as much as four times the regular damage on one end, and damage worth one hit on the other. This leads to lots of variation in how effective the attack command is, which isn't really great for balance.

Now all of the stuff I said above for regular attacks? ALSO applies to counter attacks. Oh, and enemies get to use the same system for executing attacks, meaning you get to feel the brunt of the uneven damage yourself. It's honestly rather absurd, and should have really required some mechanism to control it, be it your to hit(which isn't a real stat in this but whatever), a timed minigame, or perhaps even a special command that consumed some kind of resource.

Technically speaking, there's the concept of timed hits alluded to in the manual. The problems with the implementation are that you only get the prompts for timed hits at random(a think sound when you or your enemies move to attack), and that getting the right inputs in doesn't really guarantee a double or critical hit or even a counterattack, merely raises the chances of it happening. So, uh yeah, basically it never matters much.



In addition to all of the above, Artur can randomly get a "dual attack" like this. Only he can ever score it, and it seems to either deal the damage of two dual attacks, or a critical attack. So effectively it's just an additional chance for him to score those two outcomes. Moving on.



The Tumblerabbit is as unremarkable as every enemy here, except for one thing; occasionally it jumps through the air to deliver an attack on Artur, complete with comical spring sound effect. It's quite hilarious actually.



Quote
Annie slowly steps backwards
Annie: Leave me alone!
Artur and Steiner cautiously move forward
Annie: I said, "Leave me alone!"
Annie runs to the stairwell on the left
Steiner: Wait. Which way was the dangerous path? It was... left. Right?

Indeed it was. So, they deliberately write Annie to be a brat and then deliberately also write her to be rash. I'm not sure we're supposed to care for her, outside of her being the protagonist's sister(or sister figure). Anyway, let's pretend we do care and go the dangerous way downwards.



Down here, a chest holds this Source of Wisdom. There's a bunch of various Sources around in this game, and they basically act as stat boosts. As you might guess, this one boosts the magic casting stat, called "IQ" in this game. This is perhaps the least useful stat to boost, and I'll show you why in due time.

At level 3, Artur learns FireLevel1. It's a decent enough spell for now, hitting about as hard as a critical attack. This also gives me an opportunity to showcase the uselessness of IQ. Pictured, Artur hurling a fireball without drinking the Source of Wisdom:



And with:



Admittedly, that's just one IQ boosting potion, however it will quickly become apparent that IQ has little to no impact on how much damage a spell does. Infact, it's best to consider spells as fixed damage sources. This also leads to spells becoming outdated surprisingly quickly, as you can imagine.

Unfortunately, for as helpful as FireLevel1 is now, Artur only has enough MP to cast it once. So the rest of the dungeon is still the same ol' Attack and Item routine.

Quote
A scream is heard as Artur descends further downward
Steiner: Artur! That's her! Something must have happened! Let's hurry up and find her!

Down the stairwell lies..



Ugh, that looks gruesome. Let's hurry up!

Quote
Steiner: Annie is in trouble! Artur, what are we going to do?
Artur and Steiner nod to each other, then proceed to move to both sides of the creature and fight it. Unfortunately this has little effect, and both are thrown back hard.
They try once more, and fail, this time running into each other. The creature moves away from them.

Annie: HELP!!
Both of them get up, and Steiner tries to pull Annie out of the grasp of the creature, with little success
Annie: Steiner, please... Help me!
Steiner: Just hang on, Annie! I'll save you.
Annie: Steiner, I... I can... no longer...
The creature promptly slips out of sight, tossing Steiner backwards. When both of them get up, all that remains are a bunch of bubbles where the creature once rose from. Steiner checks the spot dejectedly, and this plays
Steiner: Artur, we have got to do something! There must be a way to rescue her!

So we went from Annie being a brat and running rashly into dangerous caves to Annie being captured by a horrible swamp monster, possibly dead. That sure escalated quick.
Leaving makes Steiner prompt this:
Quote
Steiner: Artur, we can't leave her here! We must do something!

Indeed, we must.

Taking the other stairwell, we soon end up here:



That sure looks like a spring to me, so let's fill our Flask! To do this, we need to select the Flask in our Item menu while facing the spring. Using it gets us the Spirit Water, complete with happy jingle. Unfortunately, we can't drink it, merely look at it.

Rushing through many, many dull encounters back to the swamp on the left...

Quote
Steiner: Artur, try everything you can to save Annie!

Using the Spirit Water on the swamp leads to...

Quote
The creature from earlier shrieks in pain, rising up and tossing out Annie in a fit.
It retreats quickly.
Steiner rushes to Annie's side

Steiner: Annie! Wake up! Wake up, Annie! It's no use... We have to try something else.
Artur nods and pours a few drops of Spirit Water into Annie's mouth.
Both of them then wait and watch as she slowly regains consciousness.

Annie: Uuummm... <cough>
Annie: Uuuh... <cough>
Annie: Mmmm...
Annie gets up, everyone rejoices, and this tune plays
Annie: I... I was... ehh?
Annie looks around a bit perplexed
Annie: The Kraken dragged me underwater! I don't even want to think about it!
Steiner: Annie, I'm so relieved. You sound all right.
Steiner: Artur, let's go. We shouldn't stay here too long.
Annie: I'm scared... I can't walk alone. Take me with you, okay?

And with that, we finally get a second party member. Took them long enough.
Annie is more mage like than Artur, as far as her stat distribution and equipment goes. She also starts at level 1 and currently hits for rather pathetic damage with her rod, making one wonder how she even got through the cave in the first place. While she starts with 10 MP, she bizarrely knows no spells to cast.

You might also be noticing a pattern with the dialogue.. a lot of it repeats a few key points over and over, and honestly leaves little room for interpretation. As such, I think it would be wiser for me to start summarizing scenes and only highlighting some notable sentences when necessary.



Having a second party member finally lets us access the Tactics menu. Charge is supposed to make the team fight aggressively, Fight make them fight normally, Reserve make them conserve resources like items and mana, and Guard make them defend themselves. Honestly, none of them matter though, since Manual lets you have direct control and is often better for decision making than the other options.

The only other thing of note in this cave is this bizarre room:



I have no clue if this is supposed to be us on a cliff top, or some otherworldly landscape in the depths of this cave, or perhaps a rendering error.

Well, this cave was pretty dull when we had one party member, and with two it's honestly not even worth mentioning. Time to leave!

Quote
Steiner: Artur, it's getting dark. We should hurry back home.

Will do, but that will have to wait for next time!

 2 
 on: 23, September, 2021, 08:12:29 PM 
Started by Caledor - Last post by Caledor
Do Gameshark or Action Replay codes work with this mod? I only ask because I used the Golden Sun Password Generator to transfer from the previous game and didn't realize you needed top have Event 3 UNchecked on the Misc tab. I'd like to be able to add the Golden Ring to my inventory but I'm worried the cheats will conflict with the mod. Sweat Drop

Unless i moved items around and it 100% isn't the case for Golden Ring due to how it's acquired it should be safe.

What's always safe is pick an editor, open the rom, add the item as a guaranteed drop from a random enemy close to you, get it, save, switch back to the regular rom and continue as if nothing happened.

 3 
 on: 23, September, 2021, 05:10:12 AM 
Started by Caledor - Last post by PathofChaos
Do Gameshark or Action Replay codes work with this mod? I only ask because I used the Golden Sun Password Generator to transfer from the previous game and didn't realize you needed top have Event 3 UNchecked on the Misc tab. I'd like to be able to add the Golden Ring to my inventory but I'm worried the cheats will conflict with the mod. Sweat Drop

 4 
 on: 22, September, 2021, 11:48:30 PM 
Started by Caledor - Last post by PathofChaos
I wonder.. is the Laughing Fungus still useless? Or is it destined for something greater in this mod?

The fortune teller says something about forging a weapon from it...

 5 
 on: 22, September, 2021, 06:20:09 AM 
Started by Salanewt - Last post by PathofChaos
Its nice to see this forum is still updated in 2021. Cheers!

 6 
 on: 22, September, 2021, 06:15:11 AM 
Started by Rolina - Last post by PathofChaos
Hello there! I believe I may have found a problem. In Golden Sun: TLA Reloaded there is supposed to be a Mercury Djinn Mercury Djinni Set southwest of Naribwe Village, in a bit of forest. I've been fighting there for hours and Chill will not appear. Could this be some kind of glitch?

When installing this romhack, I followed the directions to the letter and made sure to use a clean, brand new ROM file.
Has anyone ever had this happen? How can I fix it? I tried looking for Mercury Djinni Set Chill both before recruiting Piers and again after recruiting Piers

I leveled from 18 - 21 just in that area and still never encountered Chill Sad any help would be appreciated.

 Sweat Drop Nevermind, I'm dumb. Caledor kindly pointed out that Chill and Mud have switched encounters in his epic, Golden Sun Reloaded mod.

 7 
 on: 08, September, 2021, 11:10:24 PM 
Started by Caledor - Last post by HyperMushrambo
Ohhhh gotcha. I forgot there was more than one of him! You're right it was the one in the catacombs.

 8 
 on: 08, September, 2021, 12:20:13 PM 
Started by Caledor - Last post by Caledor
Separate question/error maybe? I thought from the drops section the Mad Plant was supposed to always drop the Herbed Shirt. "Mad Plant (Lv 25)        -> Herbed Shirt       1/1" But I just beat it and it only dropped a game ticket. I tried again, even making sure I took it out with a mars Djinn and it still only dropped the ticket.

It probably wasn't the LV25 one. looking at game data, you probably fought the lv19 one, which actually drops game ticket. If i had to guess by area levels, i'd say the LV25 is the one in gaia rock, while LV19 is the one in Gabomba Catacombs.

 9 
 on: 07, September, 2021, 11:38:21 PM 
Started by Caledor - Last post by HyperMushrambo
Separate question/error maybe? I thought from the drops section the Mad Plant was supposed to always drop the Herbed Shirt. "Mad Plant (Lv 25)        -> Herbed Shirt       1/1" But I just beat it and it only dropped a game ticket. I tried again, even making sure I took it out with a mars Djinn and it still only dropped the ticket.

 10 
 on: 07, September, 2021, 10:40:39 PM 
Started by Caledor - Last post by HyperMushrambo
Quote
Not mechanically; just some items have shifted around. The trick to save right before you talk to Sunshine and keep resetting until you get the desired item still works (or memory viewing if you're into that).

I hate the forging system so much. It's so time consuming trying to get the one thing you want over and over.

Quote
Bosses are now more vulnerable to debuffs that reduce their Attack, Defense and Agility and for longer than just 1 or 2 rounds. They are still immune to Poison/Venom (because otherwise these would be brokenly overpowering), and depending on the boss in question it is also easier to apply Seal, Stun, Sleep or Delusion. Different bosses have different debuff weaknesses in other words. Keep in mind that the new stat Ailment increases your chances of applying a debuff. Ailment is mostly found on cursed equipment, but you can find it on other items as well.
Djinn are susceptible to Stun, Seal and Sleep. I can confirm this because this was my go-to way to defeat them on Hard mode where they wreak havoc with their multitarget psynergies. It's just a matter of RNG if you get it to work because the creature does a Luck vs. Ailment check. I cannot say for Poison and Venom because I have not used these at all outside of weapon unleashes.

I'm just not a fan of useless psynergy. The game has a lot of "bloat" psynergy that's just pointless and I was kinda under the impression that the mod was intended to help open up the options to allow for for more strategy but it seems "Heal" and "hit hard" are the only two options, it's just a matter of which character does which.

Quote
In my experience bosses would not use Break with only 1 or 2 buffs; instead if everyone in the party was buffed (ie. 4 buffs) then they use it. So you can "fool" the AI by buffing with Guard your 2 most vulnerable characters. This is different than vanilla where I think some enemies/bosses would use Break even if you weren't buffed at all.

Ah I think I understand. To me, buff bloating is like 3 or 4 full party boosts, not ONE full party boost. That's 1 buff not 4 by the way I look at it. So it feels more like I'm being punished for trying to support my party AT ALL.

Quote
This is different from my experience. Dual element classes generally make your characters more durable; not significantly compared to mono-element but definitely easier to avoid one-shots when your djinn count is low. Of course the downside is that summoning is harder to pull off properly because you may spend more time in weaker classes, but the lack of Djinn Blast / Djinn Storm in The Broken Seal means that you do not face any serious trouble.
Regarding your attempt to use dual-classes without success, I notice that you mention Ivan and Mia as classes with 5 djinn, and Garet as a class with 9 djinn. I will assume that you mean Garet is Samurai and not Ronin (renamed Shogun in the mod). In other words you empowered Isaac and Garet who are already more durable by design, at the expense of survivability on your more fragile characters. I did the exact opposite and instead used the following: Ivan - Wise, Isaac - Black Knight, Garet - Star Knight, Mia - Thaumaturge. You will notice that everyone is more durable compared to their mono-element class except for Garet. This also gave me 2 healers that alternate healing depending on if one of them needs to do some other supportive action.
Also a great tip: Dull and Blunt are amazing against bosses. I have a screenshot at home where Deadbeard hits Ivan for just 2 points of damage. For reference check this post of mine from last year. I wonder why I never uploaded it.

I think I see what you mean, and yes I miss-remembered the names of the lower levels for Samurai my bad. My problem was even with them as beefy as I could get them, they were still the two getting downed the most (with Mia and Ivan being at the ends they were getting hit the most). I tried to use Dull on FD but it didn't work at all. It did help a bit with Deadbeard. I think GS1 is just always going to be more limited class-wise compared to TLA and that's what I was feeling most.


Quote
There is no "wrong" way to play, just less optimal. Of course there are always faster and/or easier ways, but the great thing about the mod is that it allows many strategies and classes to work assuming the party is properly arranged. For example you mention that battles drain you a lot of PP through Wish, which can be resolved by switching to classes with higher passive damage mitigation, or by alternating Granite/Flash as you mention, or by spamming Ember and Psynergy Crystals, or by equipping items with PP-regen, or by using defensive buffs on your characters or by applying debuffs on enemies!

-=EDIT=-
As always, I take so damn long to complete a reply that Caledor has already answered everything  Happy

Caledor is a beast, they answered while I was actually editing my first post! I never expected a reply so quickly it was kinda awesome.  Joy

I think I'm getting a better picture of the choices from that. I think the area around Kimobo is kinda a weird spot anyway in terms of options. Once I get on the boat I might feel like I have a bit more to work with.

Quote
Think of them as stat- and class-boosting djinn, not unlike a lot of the offensive ones. In fact, with the exception of Granite/Shade/Flash, Ember/Ether/Aroma, Ground/Petra, Salt/Tonic, Kite, Haze and Eddy, I have not unleashed any of the other djinn

Yeah that still really feels like a waste. Sweat Drop

Quote
I will mention from experience that Doom Dragon is defeatable on the mod, on Hard mode, at level40, with duo-element classes, without using a single Summon. Key points:
- All 8 characters need to be somewhat equally durable
- The 4 members in the back party should all be able to fulfil a supportive role
- Right after Djinn Blast, switch the character with a character in the back. Once the "main" character has recovered enough djinn, switch them back to the front
- After Djinn Storm, bring the back party to the front 1-by-1 and use Defend on the characters who do not have multitarget healing. Their output will not be worth the incoming damage.
- Your strategy should not be to maximize damage per round to make the battle last fewer turns, but instead to have enough survivability to be back at full HP at the end/start of every round. This means that even your main damage-dealing character should only deal damage if there is no helpful support action they can take.
- If your main healer is about to run out of PP, bring a back-party character in their spot until PP-regen does its thing. With over 40PP/round in end-game gear and Ether/Aroma/Ember, you have virtually infinite PP.
- Do not ignore items. Potions are very powerful 0-PP-cost ST heals. Vials are good alternatives.

I cannot tell about Dullahan as I have yet to defeat him, but it's not Djinn Storm that's the most dangerous move...

Yeah I'm more concerned about Dullahan. My experience with him is he uses Djinn Storm probably once every other turn (Sometimes you get lucky and he does it twice in the same turn or immediately the next turn and uses up his attacks) so you have to do the entire battle without your Djinn. And in doing so, you have no choice but to use the base classes because otherwise you'll just be a mess as you get bounced around between junk class to junk class with no control over it. If that's the case here too then there's no point in trying to strategize with any of the new fun classes like Jenna and Piers' because I don't get to use them anyway. At that point even considering anything that's not the base class is just a liability. That's why with him it's always best to just summon rush him at the beginning of the battle because you ain't touchin' those djinn again for the rest of the fight. Since that's not an option in this mod well... I have worries.

Please note none of my feedback is intended to be unkind. I think Caledor has done some amazing work here, and I don't want to diminish that at all. I just have some concerns from my current perspective and I feel a little disheartened after finding out that the amount of useless djinn and psynergy has increased not decreased.

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Chatbox
01, September, 2021, 02:55:35 PM
Daddy Poi's Oily Gorillas: At least for warps.
01, September, 2021, 02:55:01 PM
Daddy Poi's Oily Gorillas: To think that events are not done via a tilemap in GS3 is interesting, and they'd just be cubes in the size of a tile (I think)... with given coords.
28, March, 2021, 06:10:33 PM
Salanewt: Tiny announcement down here that a new animation pack is now available for download! The Animation Overhaul is required; see the downloads page for more details.
03, March, 2021, 03:16:30 AM
Daddy Poi's Oily Gorillas: I'm happy ACE is possible and easy in GS1. :D Thank you Tret. Now if we can get GS2 Air's Rock to do ACE, wouldn't that be something.
18, February, 2021, 03:25:26 PM
Salanewt: The one here has everything: http://forum.goldensunhacking.net/index.php?action=downloads;sa=view;down=132
18, February, 2021, 02:03:20 PM
VardenSalad: It looks like Atrius' editor download is broken again. The only thing in the .zip is the background image
13, February, 2021, 03:15:41 PM
MaxiPower: Welcom back Charon. been a long time.
11, February, 2021, 09:40:04 PM
Daddy Poi's Oily GorillasSo how long is this site going to be "This website is still under construction, please excuse the mess." :D
04, February, 2021, 12:56:21 AM
charon the ferryman: LMAO i love 2010 tech
04, February, 2021, 12:56:07 AM
charon the ferryman: release me from my discord prison meme mortals
15, November, 2020, 03:45:26 PM
Salanewt: We're more alive than the board implies; most discussion takes place over on the Discord server.
15, November, 2020, 03:45:06 PM
Salanewt: Haha, heya!
15, November, 2020, 02:07:50 PM
Frog: Nice to see this place is still alive...ish anyway xD
30, October, 2020, 11:10:23 PM
Salanewt: ... Actually, it's almost time for me to post an update on the forum. It's been coming along really nicely overall, and it was only a couple months or so ago that I added some new status effects to the game.
30, October, 2020, 11:08:41 PM
Salanewt: I need to get it done to start making progress on the parts of the AI Overhaul I want to start working on.
30, October, 2020, 11:08:14 PM
Salanewt: It's going well! I wanted to get more of my djinn reform done this week but I've been busy with other things sadly.
30, October, 2020, 09:58:14 PM
KyleRunner: Hi guys! How are you doing?
13, October, 2020, 11:19:21 AM
MaxiPower: first chapter of my golden sun inspired webtoon is now live. be cool if yas could check it out. https://www.webtoons.com/en/challenge/legacy-of-the-lost-dragoon/the-northern-reaches/viewer?title_no=508487&episode_no=6
31, August, 2020, 08:40:32 AM
Daddy Poi's Oily Gorillas: Being able to convert IPS files to text files to also supporting commenting, and convert back to IPS after changes.... sounds like a fun strategy? 
27, August, 2020, 10:37:30 PM
Salanewt: Hey, thanks! 
25, August, 2020, 12:59:22 AM
Foreclosure: Yo! Looking forward for this AI OVerhaul patch when it's finished :) :) 
19, August, 2020, 07:00:17 PM
Salanewt: That's awesome! I'm pretty good; been working on an AI Overhaul project and have made some nice progress in the past couple weeks; the goal for tonight is to add Deadbeard to GS2 and then I can move onto something new.
19, August, 2020, 01:14:56 PM
Awec: Ye not bad, just checked back in for updates on GS Reloaded really. Although now I'm looking back through some of my old forum posts, which is fun :D how are you?
19, August, 2020, 01:43:07 AM
Salanewt: It sure is! How have you been?
16, August, 2020, 09:40:57 AM
Awec: Yo nice to see this forum is still going
14, August, 2020, 09:06:44 PM
Salanewt: Hey! How goes it?
01, August, 2020, 01:31:53 PM
KyleRunner: Hello, people!
08, July, 2020, 08:57:11 PM
Salanewt: That awkward feeling when almost a quarter of a year goes by without anyone posting a message in this chatbox.
27, April, 2020, 07:54:10 PM
Daddy Poi's Oily Gorillas: I'm having a thought. So I know Atrius's editor is slow at saving sprites.... So I've been thinking.   I am considering another console program.  This time, for importing and exporting sprites/animations. Image files (for sprites), binary files (for animation data), and maybe binary or text files for Settings. Would certainly be cool if it works out. - Console programs are fun, when you can (at least temporarily) cheat out making a full interface editor for them. =P

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