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Author Topic: Helpful and Unique Patches  (Read 28272 times)
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Rolina
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« Reply #30 on: May 21, 2014, 12:28:24 AM »

Do we even understand how those vulnerabilities work yet?
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Salanewt
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« Reply #31 on: May 21, 2014, 01:28:31 AM »

From what I understand, there are a whole bunch of different ability effects that work such as eRes debuffs or instant death. I haven't really researched it yet, but all I know is that it boosts their success rate according to what Teawater says.

As for the 50% HP revive, I'm not sure if that one would work. However, I wouldn't be surprised if all of the % revives share the same function and only define the values to use for HP restoration/success rates; that's what the % healing effects do.
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JamietheFlameUser
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« Reply #32 on: May 21, 2014, 02:37:12 AM »

We have a basic idea. As far as design goes, what you really need to know is that each class can have up to three vulnerabilities, and each monster can have up to four. If using the numeric display version, you enter the index number of the secondary effect you wish them to be vulnerable to. Vulnerability to effect = increased chance of the effect occurring. How much the chance is increased, I don't know. But a character or monster probably still retains immunity to standard Stun by having 39 or higher Luck, even if they also have vulnerability to that effect.
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« Reply #33 on: May 21, 2014, 03:10:51 AM »

From what I understand, having 40+ luck only grants actual immunity to a small collection of effects (poison/venom/curse/death/HP to 1/maybe one or two others), but you'll still be quite resistant to almost everything else.

However, something to note is that certain bosses are actually vulnerable to things like debuffs. Dullahan is vulnerable to Attack 12.5/25% reductions for example. If you're lucky and you land a dull or Eclipse debuff on it, then you can lower its attack. Sad to say that I don't know the ailment success rate for the attack debuff effects (just that recovery has a base of 30% when calculated in the random recovery formula), so it could also be that stat debuffs have a higher success rate than standard ailments.


I'm thinking that we should totally have a topic somewhere to discuss ailment stuff, as there is a lot that we can talk about.
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« Reply #34 on: May 21, 2014, 08:05:37 AM »

I'm thinking that we should totally have a topic somewhere to discuss ailment stuff, as there is a lot that we can talk about.
Role already created that topic:  Ailment and Debuff formulas:  http://forum.goldensunhacking.net/index.php?topic=2067.0 = I listed both known effect formulas in that topic. The success rate of an effect, and ailment recovering formulas. I have not listed all the effects that use the former formula, though.


@Jamie: I think it was three vulnerabilities for both Class and Enemies... if I recall correctly. The chance increase of a Vulnerability is +25% ; I think this is only for the effects that use the formula, though. The ones that don't use the formula have a base-chance that doesn't change. (From what I recall from memory.)

Revive to 50%, by the sound of it, probably doesn't use this formula, and therefore, doesn't take into account of the Vulnerability.  Do all Revives have a 100% chance of occurring? If so, then one can logically say they don't need the formula.

Edit again: I almost forgot to mention that buggy version I shouldn't be talking about.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2014, 11:20:44 AM by Teawater » Logged

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« Reply #35 on: May 21, 2014, 12:59:06 PM »

Oh, oops. Didn't even realize that topic existed!

For revives, nope. I think most of them have a success rate that is equivalent to the amount they heal (so like the revive to 50% HP one for example).


So for this topic (specifically the first post), how do you guys like it?
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« Reply #36 on: May 21, 2014, 01:08:07 PM »

[me] approves!
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JamietheFlameUser
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« Reply #37 on: May 21, 2014, 05:30:05 PM »

@Jamie: I think it was three vulnerabilities for both Class and Enemies... if I recall correctly. The chance increase of a Vulnerability is +25% ; I think this is only for the effects that use the formula, though. The ones that don't use the formula have a base-chance that doesn't change. (From what I recall from memory.)
There are definitely four numbers along the bottom for enemies, and I assume all four of them are vulnerabilities. Certainly, I've never had any adverse effects from changing the last of those numbers, which makes me believe that to be the case. Character classes only have three numbers along the bottom in versions of the editor where they couldn't be changed, and three slots along the bottom in versions where they can.
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Salanewt
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« Reply #38 on: May 21, 2014, 05:38:06 PM »

Well yeah, but it could also be a regular unused value that wouldn't do anything anyway. Which, seeing as Teawater has researched those a fair bit, could be pretty likely.

Also yay, Scarlet likes it! Guess I'll consider that to be the general layout for these topics if nobody else has anything to say then. I might consider putting everything in a spoiler when there are more patches though, but even then it would only be a single spoiler.
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And the Wise One is a Mary Sue!

Hey there! I see you over there, looking at me... Wanna come over for a Milk Drink? ;)
Fusion is just a cheap tactic to make weak Adepts stronger.
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« Reply #39 on: May 21, 2014, 07:12:13 PM »

@Salanewt: Yeah, researched them a fair bit... The numbers at 080B0712 and 080B0736 give it away, too! Since both are the number 2... which means check 0, 1, and 2. ; The final/fourth number is likely unused, seeing that it's always 0. (And it might be that way for data aligning. Since 32-bits are 32-bit aligned, 16-bits are 16-bit aligned, 8-bits are 8-bit aligned, etc... usually.)
« Last Edit: May 21, 2014, 07:14:58 PM by Teawater » Logged

Golden Sun Docs: Broken Seal - The Lost Age - Dark Dawn | Mario Sports Docs: Mario Golf & Mario Tennis | Misc. Docs
Refer to Yoshi's Lighthouse for any M&L hacking needs...
*Cross my fingers and hope we have Big Brother All-Stars next year... with Paulie & Cody Califorie(sp?)... and Vanessa & Tiffany Rousso.... Would be fun? :P Especially if one of the boys got evicted early since there's usually some all-guy alliance in there, right?
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JamietheFlameUser
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« Reply #40 on: June 09, 2014, 03:36:58 PM »

So I noticed something annoying: If you give a damage-dealing ability the effect "Instantly end round", the effect doesn't trigger if the target is killed by the attack.

It would be really cool to have a patch that fixed this, so that the secondary effect still activated even if the target died. I'm trying to have cinematic finishing moves that can only be used one per turn because they instantly end the turn when used, but it doesn't work if it can fail just because it killed the target (when it hits over 2000 damage in a single attack, that's gonna happen pretty often).
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Salanewt
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« Reply #41 on: June 10, 2014, 03:23:24 PM »

Hm... I haven't really looked into the effect, but I would expect that it checks to see if the target is still alive or not. Not sure why they would do this unless the effect itself could bypass the whole "end battle when one team is dead" thing.

But yeah, I should be able to work on that in the near future. I'm thinking of adding Chronos as a Disco Sun summon later, and it would be cool to let to deal some minor damage to the enemies or something.
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And the Wise One is a Mary Sue!

Hey there! I see you over there, looking at me... Wanna come over for a Milk Drink? ;)
Fusion is just a cheap tactic to make weak Adepts stronger.
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Fox
Fox McCloud, the Hacking Doctor
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« Reply #42 on: June 11, 2014, 09:24:29 AM »

Look in the Ability Effects section of the Damage Formula. I believe that entire section is skipped when you kill the enemy? (The exception is with two functions that list the effects.) (Maybe so you don't go applying Status Effects like poison when the enemy is already dead.)

The function that list exceptions for Revives probably doesn't work on enemies that are alive. (Dunno.)
The function that list exceptions for when the user gains HP/PP might be the way to go, not entirely sure, though.

The latter has a listing of the 4 effects: 31, 32, 60, and 69.


I think the general way effects are coding in is that..
-There's a start a turn function for the multiplier type effects.
-The ailment success function is only for success chances for the effects. There's a call in the damage function before the damage type code is done, and there's a call in the Start a turn function thingy... both seem to do the same thing. (The one in the Start a turn function is only used in certain case(s) and caries the result over for use in the damage function when it is used.)
-The damage formula includes the after-damage effects. This is only applied in certain cases. One of those cases being if Ailment Success is True. Probably the main place where effects have a chance? Ailment Success may also be used for the Effect Only damage type and maybe for some other effects in other areas of the code? (I mentioned the Start a turn function earlier.)
-There were two functions that list effects. The Revives list, and User recovers HP/PP effects list.
-There might be some other places(?), but I haven't listed them.

-
« Last Edit: June 11, 2014, 10:55:33 AM by Teawater » Logged

Golden Sun Docs: Broken Seal - The Lost Age - Dark Dawn | Mario Sports Docs: Mario Golf & Mario Tennis | Misc. Docs
Refer to Yoshi's Lighthouse for any M&L hacking needs...
*Cross my fingers and hope we have Big Brother All-Stars next year... with Paulie & Cody Califorie(sp?)... and Vanessa & Tiffany Rousso.... Would be fun? :P Especially if one of the boys got evicted early since there's usually some all-guy alliance in there, right?
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JamietheFlameUser
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« Reply #43 on: June 11, 2014, 05:33:01 PM »

I would think that you could make "Instantly End Round" work even if the ability kills by looking at the code for "May inflict delusion on all enemies". Which, to my recollection, still works even if the attack kills the primary target.
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Salanewt
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« Reply #44 on: June 14, 2014, 12:46:25 AM »

Hm... Done!

Teawater: Sweet, thanks for the advice! The way it's normally coded is pretty weird, but not in a bad way it seems. It has a check for "if equal than 60, branch" before an "if greater than 60, branch" check, but the second check just goes to another check. I didn't even need to expand or relocate the function to add this exception!

Jamie: As far as I can tell, both of the delusion effects use the same code; the second one probably uses a secondary function to apply it to all targets. If you change the second delusion effect's pointer, then you could change that effect into something like "inflict curse on all enemies" or something.

Well anyway, here's a fix. Could you please let me know if it breaks either the Lull or any of the HP/PP drain effects? If it works without a hitch, then I'll make a page for it in the downloads section and update the first post.








* KO Compatible Lull.ips (0.03 KB - downloaded 72 times.)
« Last Edit: June 14, 2014, 01:05:33 AM by Lord Squirtle » Logged

And the Wise One is a Mary Sue!

Hey there! I see you over there, looking at me... Wanna come over for a Milk Drink? ;)
Fusion is just a cheap tactic to make weak Adepts stronger.
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Today at 12:18:56 PM
Fox: Welcome back!
Today at 09:12:43 AM
Luna_blade: back from vacation
Yesterday at 02:29:26 AM
Fox: That moment when you realize that there is a lot of chatting going on on Discord, that there is no point in trying to keep up. :P  Hm....
August 16, 2017, 04:50:22 AM
Fox: (Then again, just because posting is disabled, doesn't necessarily mean the buttons would be removed as well.)
August 16, 2017, 04:48:55 AM
Fox: (I mean, buttons I would expect to be similar to that.... rather than those specifically since I recall posting there to be disabled.)
August 16, 2017, 04:33:02 AM
Fox: Yeah... I like to think of it as a page loaded with ads. And it's not just the forum home page either... check the sub-forums/topics themselves. == New Topic/Reply/etc. buttons were affected.
August 15, 2017, 07:04:30 PM
Salanewt: Lol, nice. :P
August 15, 2017, 06:33:02 PM
Foxhttp://z9.invisionfree.com/Golden_Sun_Hacking/index.php? == Hahaha! GSHC Classic looks funny now that Photobucket killed the images. :P Anyway, how is everyone doing today?
August 14, 2017, 07:12:02 PM
Salanewt: So yeah, I'm typing up a non-academic essay on why GS2 was rushed; expect that sometime soon!
August 07, 2017, 05:53:11 AM
Fox: But anyway, such a hack mod is simply an idea, and I do not have any current plans to work on it at this time, so.....
August 07, 2017, 05:51:46 AM
Fox: Okay, cool. I think my idea works best without an ability to swap PCs (OR to just simply make that use it the PC's turn.) Hmmm... And with that, I question if a turn list is even needed with my approach. (Outside of maybe 1 entry, if that shortens the modifications.)
August 07, 2017, 05:13:26 AM
Salanewt: To be honest I've been thinking of expanding the battle turn section and also adding code for PCs to have more than two turns in the AI overhaul, but I probably won't allow anyone to have more than four.
August 06, 2017, 12:22:17 AM
Fox: Oh, and if that approach was taken = Would like to also have it so you select the spell to use when it is actually your turn rather than at round start.
August 06, 2017, 12:12:37 AM
Fox: Would take a lot of balancing, but I can see an adept being very slow, and yet very powerful.
August 06, 2017, 12:06:11 AM
Fox: And bosses can have an Agility that is above half of the maximum possible Agility. Mwahaha.
August 06, 2017, 12:04:14 AM
Fox: Hmm... What if Agility could be recodded to allow for multiple turns per round? Obvious, calculations could be made in a way that depending on your Agility, you could like get a different number of turns each round. (eg. 1 turn this round, 2 the next, 1 turn again.) Obviously, To ensure 2 turns all the time, you should have at least double the opponent's agility,.... erm...something. So... you/or enmy could be so fast, the opponent can't even make a move, unless turns are capped.
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Fox: ( That keeps search engines from indexing them... :) )
August 05, 2017, 08:45:44 PM
Fox: Also, it's not 100% public if Guests can't see them. (They can't), but who cares about Guests anyway. =P
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Fox: @Clan forums: Mars clan has the most posts, and Venus clan has the most topics. So umm having 1k+ posts makes Mars.... interesting?
August 05, 2017, 08:16:43 PM
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