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Author Topic: Helpful and Unique Patches  (Read 30367 times)
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Rolina
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« Reply #30 on: May 21, 2014, 12:28:24 AM »

Do we even understand how those vulnerabilities work yet?
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« Reply #31 on: May 21, 2014, 01:28:31 AM »

From what I understand, there are a whole bunch of different ability effects that work such as eRes debuffs or instant death. I haven't really researched it yet, but all I know is that it boosts their success rate according to what Teawater says.

As for the 50% HP revive, I'm not sure if that one would work. However, I wouldn't be surprised if all of the % revives share the same function and only define the values to use for HP restoration/success rates; that's what the % healing effects do.
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JamietheFlameUser
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« Reply #32 on: May 21, 2014, 02:37:12 AM »

We have a basic idea. As far as design goes, what you really need to know is that each class can have up to three vulnerabilities, and each monster can have up to four. If using the numeric display version, you enter the index number of the secondary effect you wish them to be vulnerable to. Vulnerability to effect = increased chance of the effect occurring. How much the chance is increased, I don't know. But a character or monster probably still retains immunity to standard Stun by having 39 or higher Luck, even if they also have vulnerability to that effect.
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« Reply #33 on: May 21, 2014, 03:10:51 AM »

From what I understand, having 40+ luck only grants actual immunity to a small collection of effects (poison/venom/curse/death/HP to 1/maybe one or two others), but you'll still be quite resistant to almost everything else.

However, something to note is that certain bosses are actually vulnerable to things like debuffs. Dullahan is vulnerable to Attack 12.5/25% reductions for example. If you're lucky and you land a dull or Eclipse debuff on it, then you can lower its attack. Sad to say that I don't know the ailment success rate for the attack debuff effects (just that recovery has a base of 30% when calculated in the random recovery formula), so it could also be that stat debuffs have a higher success rate than standard ailments.


I'm thinking that we should totally have a topic somewhere to discuss ailment stuff, as there is a lot that we can talk about.
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« Reply #34 on: May 21, 2014, 08:05:37 AM »

I'm thinking that we should totally have a topic somewhere to discuss ailment stuff, as there is a lot that we can talk about.
Role already created that topic:  Ailment and Debuff formulas:  http://forum.goldensunhacking.net/index.php?topic=2067.0 = I listed both known effect formulas in that topic. The success rate of an effect, and ailment recovering formulas. I have not listed all the effects that use the former formula, though.


@Jamie: I think it was three vulnerabilities for both Class and Enemies... if I recall correctly. The chance increase of a Vulnerability is +25% ; I think this is only for the effects that use the formula, though. The ones that don't use the formula have a base-chance that doesn't change. (From what I recall from memory.)

Revive to 50%, by the sound of it, probably doesn't use this formula, and therefore, doesn't take into account of the Vulnerability.  Do all Revives have a 100% chance of occurring? If so, then one can logically say they don't need the formula.

Edit again: I almost forgot to mention that buggy version I shouldn't be talking about.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2014, 11:20:44 AM by Teawater » Logged

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Did you know? In English, you are suppose to capitalize the languages. (e.g. English is a proper noun.) Subjects like math, science, history can be left lower-cased unless they are a title. (Kind of like how you can say either "my mom" or "Mom" in "I went with (X) to the store.", except that I don't think languages are ever lower-cased in English.) In Spanish, both subjects and languages are left lower-cased. (I put this here because I've noticed people make this mistake quite often. And am curious if they know about this, and whether they use their way because they believe this grammar usage should have never been a thing?

Remember kids! In getting a job, it's not about what you know, it's about WHO you know! So start making friends with the people that work where you want to work. :) (Friend of a friend and volunteering count too, so keep that in mind.)[/si
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« Reply #35 on: May 21, 2014, 12:59:06 PM »

Oh, oops. Didn't even realize that topic existed!

For revives, nope. I think most of them have a success rate that is equivalent to the amount they heal (so like the revive to 50% HP one for example).


So for this topic (specifically the first post), how do you guys like it?
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« Reply #36 on: May 21, 2014, 01:08:07 PM »

[me] approves!
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« Reply #37 on: May 21, 2014, 05:30:05 PM »

@Jamie: I think it was three vulnerabilities for both Class and Enemies... if I recall correctly. The chance increase of a Vulnerability is +25% ; I think this is only for the effects that use the formula, though. The ones that don't use the formula have a base-chance that doesn't change. (From what I recall from memory.)
There are definitely four numbers along the bottom for enemies, and I assume all four of them are vulnerabilities. Certainly, I've never had any adverse effects from changing the last of those numbers, which makes me believe that to be the case. Character classes only have three numbers along the bottom in versions of the editor where they couldn't be changed, and three slots along the bottom in versions where they can.
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Salanewt
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« Reply #38 on: May 21, 2014, 05:38:06 PM »

Well yeah, but it could also be a regular unused value that wouldn't do anything anyway. Which, seeing as Teawater has researched those a fair bit, could be pretty likely.

Also yay, Scarlet likes it! Guess I'll consider that to be the general layout for these topics if nobody else has anything to say then. I might consider putting everything in a spoiler when there are more patches though, but even then it would only be a single spoiler.
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Fusion is just a cheap tactic to make weak Adepts stronger.

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« Reply #39 on: May 21, 2014, 07:12:13 PM »

@Salanewt: Yeah, researched them a fair bit... The numbers at 080B0712 and 080B0736 give it away, too! Since both are the number 2... which means check 0, 1, and 2. ; The final/fourth number is likely unused, seeing that it's always 0. (And it might be that way for data aligning. Since 32-bits are 32-bit aligned, 16-bits are 16-bit aligned, 8-bits are 8-bit aligned, etc... usually.)
« Last Edit: May 21, 2014, 07:14:58 PM by Teawater » Logged

Golden Sun Docs: Broken Seal - The Lost Age - Dark Dawn | Mario Sports Docs: Mario Golf & Mario Tennis | Misc. Docs
Refer to Yoshi's Lighthouse for any M&L hacking needs...
Did you know? In English, you are suppose to capitalize the languages. (e.g. English is a proper noun.) Subjects like math, science, history can be left lower-cased unless they are a title. (Kind of like how you can say either "my mom" or "Mom" in "I went with (X) to the store.", except that I don't think languages are ever lower-cased in English.) In Spanish, both subjects and languages are left lower-cased. (I put this here because I've noticed people make this mistake quite often. And am curious if they know about this, and whether they use their way because they believe this grammar usage should have never been a thing?

Remember kids! In getting a job, it's not about what you know, it's about WHO you know! So start making friends with the people that work where you want to work. :) (Friend of a friend and volunteering count too, so keep that in mind.)[/si
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JamietheFlameUser
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« Reply #40 on: June 09, 2014, 03:36:58 PM »

So I noticed something annoying: If you give a damage-dealing ability the effect "Instantly end round", the effect doesn't trigger if the target is killed by the attack.

It would be really cool to have a patch that fixed this, so that the secondary effect still activated even if the target died. I'm trying to have cinematic finishing moves that can only be used one per turn because they instantly end the turn when used, but it doesn't work if it can fail just because it killed the target (when it hits over 2000 damage in a single attack, that's gonna happen pretty often).
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Salanewt
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« Reply #41 on: June 10, 2014, 03:23:24 PM »

Hm... I haven't really looked into the effect, but I would expect that it checks to see if the target is still alive or not. Not sure why they would do this unless the effect itself could bypass the whole "end battle when one team is dead" thing.

But yeah, I should be able to work on that in the near future. I'm thinking of adding Chronos as a Disco Sun summon later, and it would be cool to let to deal some minor damage to the enemies or something.
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« Reply #42 on: June 11, 2014, 09:24:29 AM »

Look in the Ability Effects section of the Damage Formula. I believe that entire section is skipped when you kill the enemy? (The exception is with two functions that list the effects.) (Maybe so you don't go applying Status Effects like poison when the enemy is already dead.)

The function that list exceptions for Revives probably doesn't work on enemies that are alive. (Dunno.)
The function that list exceptions for when the user gains HP/PP might be the way to go, not entirely sure, though.

The latter has a listing of the 4 effects: 31, 32, 60, and 69.


I think the general way effects are coding in is that..
-There's a start a turn function for the multiplier type effects.
-The ailment success function is only for success chances for the effects. There's a call in the damage function before the damage type code is done, and there's a call in the Start a turn function thingy... both seem to do the same thing. (The one in the Start a turn function is only used in certain case(s) and caries the result over for use in the damage function when it is used.)
-The damage formula includes the after-damage effects. This is only applied in certain cases. One of those cases being if Ailment Success is True. Probably the main place where effects have a chance? Ailment Success may also be used for the Effect Only damage type and maybe for some other effects in other areas of the code? (I mentioned the Start a turn function earlier.)
-There were two functions that list effects. The Revives list, and User recovers HP/PP effects list.
-There might be some other places(?), but I haven't listed them.

-
« Last Edit: June 11, 2014, 10:55:33 AM by Teawater » Logged

Golden Sun Docs: Broken Seal - The Lost Age - Dark Dawn | Mario Sports Docs: Mario Golf & Mario Tennis | Misc. Docs
Refer to Yoshi's Lighthouse for any M&L hacking needs...
Did you know? In English, you are suppose to capitalize the languages. (e.g. English is a proper noun.) Subjects like math, science, history can be left lower-cased unless they are a title. (Kind of like how you can say either "my mom" or "Mom" in "I went with (X) to the store.", except that I don't think languages are ever lower-cased in English.) In Spanish, both subjects and languages are left lower-cased. (I put this here because I've noticed people make this mistake quite often. And am curious if they know about this, and whether they use their way because they believe this grammar usage should have never been a thing?

Remember kids! In getting a job, it's not about what you know, it's about WHO you know! So start making friends with the people that work where you want to work. :) (Friend of a friend and volunteering count too, so keep that in mind.)[/si
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JamietheFlameUser
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« Reply #43 on: June 11, 2014, 05:33:01 PM »

I would think that you could make "Instantly End Round" work even if the ability kills by looking at the code for "May inflict delusion on all enemies". Which, to my recollection, still works even if the attack kills the primary target.
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Salanewt
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« Reply #44 on: June 14, 2014, 12:46:25 AM »

Hm... Done!

Teawater: Sweet, thanks for the advice! The way it's normally coded is pretty weird, but not in a bad way it seems. It has a check for "if equal than 60, branch" before an "if greater than 60, branch" check, but the second check just goes to another check. I didn't even need to expand or relocate the function to add this exception!

Jamie: As far as I can tell, both of the delusion effects use the same code; the second one probably uses a secondary function to apply it to all targets. If you change the second delusion effect's pointer, then you could change that effect into something like "inflict curse on all enemies" or something.

Well anyway, here's a fix. Could you please let me know if it breaks either the Lull or any of the HP/PP drain effects? If it works without a hitch, then I'll make a page for it in the downloads section and update the first post.








* KO Compatible Lull.ips (0.03 KB - downloaded 88 times.)
« Last Edit: June 14, 2014, 01:05:33 AM by Lord Squirtle » Logged

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Yesterday at 11:10:45 PM
Fox: Yes, and there could be contests. Maybe ones where 1st/2nd/3rd place get a cash reward, but eh. Dunno.... Kind of thinking about making a topic about how people got their job, and what was their experience. (e.g. Did they use references of people already working in the job, and various other things.)
December 09, 2017, 04:24:14 AM
Majora: Import old forum posts for reference, perhaps take posts containing important info like documentation away from the old stickied forum post model and make them into their own pages on a site with an in-built search bar. Might help with SEO, too. If nothing else, perhaps whipping them into PDFs and hosting them via Scribd? The possibilities are boundless when it comes to restructuring a site
December 09, 2017, 04:20:02 AM
Majora: Just a nice idea to have even if it doesn't come to fruition. Updating, modernizing, always a good idea. Could probably do something pretty nifty using a good Wordpress theme
December 09, 2017, 04:15:45 AM
Majora: Would be kind of neat to do something like that for GSHC. Could change it up a bit to show all tweets/instagram posts/facebook posts/golden sun subreddit posts all in one sidebar. It would be cool in that it gives the site it's on (and the topic in general) appear more lively and active, which is a plus
December 09, 2017, 04:14:19 AM
Majora: That does sound interesting. One cool thing I've seen some sites use is a sort of unique take on a sidebar option that acts like a social media integration (like, "See GSHC's latest Tweets"). It displays activity from a variety of related sites, such as Reddit, Twitter, Instagram, etc.
December 09, 2017, 12:58:53 AM
Fox: And the way it'd work via code is not that all users would instantly get nicknames the minute you register... but rather, the moment you view a name if it doesn't have a nickname, it gets one. (My Thoughts.)
December 09, 2017, 12:53:55 AM
Fox: (I was thinking that it would be "Name (Nickname)" ... The nickname is what you first known the user as, and you can change that yourself... and the Name is what the user wants to be called... Something like that.
December 09, 2017, 12:47:56 AM
Fox: So like... for starters, one idea I had was to make it so anyone can name anyone... much like how it works on Skype, and you (the namer) would be the only one to see it, and such...
December 09, 2017, 12:45:02 AM
Fox: Would need to be carefully thought out and tested, though.
December 09, 2017, 12:43:02 AM
Fox: I'm thinking I could make it so that name changes can happen whenever... (Without any limit)... Since I believe there's a way to do it with minimum confusion. (I think.) Hmm....
December 09, 2017, 12:31:36 AM
Fox: (I mean an offline version... at least initially.)
December 09, 2017, 12:25:01 AM
Fox: Now that I have thought about it a bit more, would I be right to assume that GSHC would be one of the most interesting websites to administrate, or no? It's sad to see not much going on with it. == I almost want to make a concept website at some point. :D Anyway, how is everyone doing today?
December 06, 2017, 12:12:59 AM
Fox: Like... Start using Github or something... Do like how many of those other projects such as Citra (WIP 3DS Emulator) does. Etc.
December 06, 2017, 12:08:12 AM
Fox: No idea. I just wish OpenGoldenSun would release it as unfinished, but oh well.
December 05, 2017, 06:52:09 AM
MaxiPower: Bummed out that the open golden sun project is dead it seems with no actitivy in close to a year at this point. Is there any hope left in any other projects?
November 27, 2017, 10:25:28 AM
Fox: (When I say research, mainly refering to the data in the game, though checking websites can count to a degree.)
November 27, 2017, 09:52:27 AM
Fox: Maybe. But Dark Dawn is meh, hahah... I still research it, though, because data can be interesting.
November 27, 2017, 05:28:36 AM
Portakin: I'm here! This game is underrated!
November 25, 2017, 08:03:23 PM
Fox: .... and the email listed in that post makes me think we should just make a new rules topic with most of the same information. (So the old ones can be sort o archived.)
November 25, 2017, 07:59:47 PM
Fox: "and in addition to the bot being banned, I will remove the advertisement and lock the thread."  ... From what I've seen in the last couple years, this should be changed to "delete the thread."

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