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Question: If Golden Sun classes were implemented in Minecraft, which of the following methods do you think would be the most effective in translating GS stats (such as HP, Luck, etc.) to Minecraft player state data (such as
Use stats from vanilla Golden Sun as references to apply arguably equivalent effects to a Minecraft player
Scale stats from vanilla Golden Sun to fit Minecraft in a vanilla Minecraft-friendly way (no one-hit kills)
Use stats directly from vanilla Golden Sun in Minecraft without regard to how they affect vanilla Minecraft experience (my favorite, I find the vanilla Minecraft experience to be an empty shell, not to be preserved)

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Author Topic: Quick Poll - Golden Sun classes in Minecraft  (Read 4566 times)
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Rolina
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« Reply #30 on: May 29, 2016, 12:17:59 AM »

@sharing classes:  Would it matter?  One person's Knight is another person's Gladiator.  Not everyone would use them the same way, especially since he'll have to adapt all the psynergy from GS to Minecraft.  I mean, he's gonna have to figure out various things like range, shape, and duration.  Those can't be simply translated from GS to Minecraft, you know?  Still, depending on how they play, they may find Flare Wall more useful than Fireball, due to it's area being closer (and thus closer to melee range).
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Fox
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« Reply #31 on: May 29, 2016, 04:40:40 AM »

Hmm... Probably doesn't matter. (It depends on if whether anyone sees it as confusing... but I guess I kind of doubt it... )

And then the next question would be: If anyone could change the name of their own class willy-nilly, then why would we need class names? (I start seeing it as a name separate from the class itself.) (Of course, it may still serve a cosmetic role-playing experience/purpose.) And then... Chances are that people wouldn't change them too often for the same reasons we don't change our usernames often. So umm.. yeah. I guess it doesn't matter?

As for translating it to Minecraft... I guess it could depends on how you do it. (Initialize a battle much like the one in GS? Which might seem strange?..., Or have it all done on the playing field? Etc.)
Oh the giggles at just imagining how those random battles would work in multiplayer. :D Probably very annoying and not fun. - It's like we could do it the way M&L does it, and base initializing a battle screen on collision with a visible enemy.... And then there's the question/strategy/balance of how co-operative (players=allies) and competitive (players=enemies) play would work out.... Since like, if the fight occured on the overworld... your friend might be an attacker, and you might be a caster. If you use a high area-of-effect psynergy on a monster... whether it should hit your friend or not could be something to think about.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2016, 05:14:11 AM by Fox » Logged

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Rolina
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« Reply #32 on: May 30, 2016, 02:04:21 PM »

Well, to be fair, you don't "need" the mod, either.  Ars Magica, Thaumcraft, and Witchery cover a lot of what people would look for in a golden sun mod.  As such, you'd need this to act like another magical option.  Each of those has their own system, and this would provide another.  I'd personally suggest staying away from all stats save for PP, and using the PP values of the classes you're basing it off of.  This would give a "fuel" value that recovers over time to prevent spamming of psynergy.  Another thing I'd recommend is to fill in the gaps left behind by vanilla.  Remember how there isn't a Samurai counterpart to the Paladin line?  Well, minecraft players will expect that.  Remember, you're not making this for GS fans, you're making this for minecraft fans.  You have to play into that.

There would be no battle screen.  ALL of this will have to take place live.  I don't think you guys get it - Minecraft isn't turn based.  It's live.  You'll have to convert ALL of GS' spells into action RPG counterparts.  That's not an insignificant effort.  You suddenly have to start thinking about things like the shapes of spells, as well as magnitude.  Remember, GS doesn't do flat damage across the board - spells get weaker further from the main target.  You'll have to find a way to make that work in a 3D game, and you can't just take the tactical RPG and convert it to tile based, either.  They can and will cast these at angles to all three coordinates - x, y, and z.

Stats and class is literally the LAST thing you should be thinking about.  The first thing to work on?  Get the spells working and looking good in minecraft.  The rest can follow afterwards, but you NEED to make sure the damn thing actually works before you try anything else.
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Fox
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« Reply #33 on: May 30, 2016, 02:31:42 PM »

Quote
There would be no battle screen.  ALL of this will have to take place live.  I don't think you guys get it - Minecraft isn't turn based.  It's live. 
Doesn't mean we can't try it as an experiment... Basically Minecraft is an open sandbox... And I'm sure we could have several different mods taking different approaches. (But I am not planning on working on something like that any time soon...if I even choose to(?) (I wouldn't mind an all-in-one approach allowing for both options... Exclusively... and if you're a crazy dev with a wacky idea, maybe even both together as well. - One example could be the use of a special amulet that "slows down time" to properly allow for turn-based battles... I never said that was a "good idea"... but just an example.)

I know that SMBO is a multiplayer fangame that has done a battle screen thing.... (If I recall from memory.) So...


---
Also, another thing to note is that not everything in a 3D game has to be 3D... For example, those trees in SM64.... You just need to figure out special tricks and stuff... and didn't GS1/GS2 's battles sort of fake 3D? (The background and the PC/enemy sprites are 2D.) -- I am not sure if the calculation used for spell animations in battles would work enough or not... At least for a prototype.  (One of the things I haven't done a lot of studying on, unfortunately. Extracting them (The code for it) would surely take a lot of effort, though.)
« Last Edit: May 30, 2016, 03:01:30 PM by Fox » Logged

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Remember kids! Before you go on that interview, remember to wash your hands in teawater! *Coughs on hand* (Excuse me, I just coughed up a little teawater, so they're still clean!) You wouldn't want that hiring manager to be unimpressed.

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Rolina
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« Reply #34 on: May 30, 2016, 06:44:11 PM »

This would also completely alienate other mods.  You may call it an experiment, but in today's modding culture in minecraft, it's it's not something that'll work well in a mod pack, it will be ignored.

Fox... how familiar are you with Minecraft and Modded Minecraft?  The comments you're making are baffling to me, since nearly everything you just said sounds completely devoid of context.
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« Reply #35 on: May 30, 2016, 08:28:45 PM »

I do agree that it would be less used... yes... Perhaps I should wait for someone else to show interest before going into greater detail.

@Minecraft: I remember testing it out a long time ago... Similar to Terraria, which I've also played.
There's day/night... There's mining... You have to build housing/lights to survive the nights... Etc. - It's also a popular game for putting cubes together for art.

And Minecraft Modding? I don't think I even touched? (I know there is one popular one... at least... But haven't bothered with it.)


--
It's a common thing to test a game, and then end up never going back to it... However, there are cases where I do keep coming back... (like RuneScape.) And even with that one I keep taking long breaks.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2016, 08:35:44 PM by Fox » Logged

Golden Sun Docs: Broken Seal - The Lost Age - Dark Dawn | Mario Sports Docs: Mario Golf & Mario Tennis | Misc. Docs
Refer to Yoshi's Lighthouse for any M&L hacking needs...

Remember kids! Before you go on that interview, remember to wash your hands in teawater! *Coughs on hand* (Excuse me, I just coughed up a little teawater, so they're still clean!) You wouldn't want that hiring manager to be unimpressed.

May the force be with you!
Shoo! Why does it smell in here?
Maybe that's the wrong kind of force. *smirk*
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Kain
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« Reply #36 on: May 31, 2016, 11:38:34 PM »

Role, I've gotten a few warnings about you in this topic.  Please calm down.
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Rolina
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« Reply #37 on: June 02, 2016, 11:53:00 AM »

@Kain:  Why?  I've not actually done anything meriting that.  

@Fox:  Yeah, check it out, if nothing than to get a feel for the stuff I'm saying.  The three mods I'm most familiar with for magic are Ars Magica, Thaumcraft, and Witchery, each of which approach it differently (Ars Magica is spellcraft based, Thaumcraft is tool-based, Witchery is primal-based).  A GS mod would actually fit in super well, since it'd be class and level based, essentially providing a different system that wouldn't interfere with the others.  You could even tie it in with minecraft's XP system to a degree, too.  It'd be a really great addition if approached right... But, well... There are things you have to consider when transitioning from one genre and/or culture into another, and compatibility with like mods is going to be huge.  If he can pull it off, it might even get popular in magic-centric modpacks.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2016, 04:17:20 AM by Rolina » Logged

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Yesterday at 08:44:56 PM
Fox: I must say... life can be complicated..... when you have question(s) (via email) ... and it seems like they sort of get ignored. :D ; Fun, (And sometimes, a person may respond, and completely not answer the question.... so like... 3-person conversation.) Hahahaha!!
January 15, 2018, 07:26:16 PM
Fox: (path) 1 text=(address) char=(address) free=(address) ; << Well, closer to this... but yeah... even if I do choose to have defaults in the code, I could still use this method for overrides.
January 15, 2018, 07:24:28 PM
Fox: So like (path) 0 text=(address) char=(address) len=(number) ; (path) 1 free=(address) ; Or something. But that's just a quick example.
January 15, 2018, 06:59:14 PM
Fox: Hopefully. I was wanting to make it so you could put in the addresses/etc. as one of the arguments in the path. Hm?
January 15, 2018, 03:37:07 PM
KyleRunner: Nice! I hope you'll add compatibility with others games (GS1, Mario Golf and Tennis) soon.
January 14, 2018, 11:40:09 PM
Fox: Okay. Posted (in Downloads section) an initial cutdown version for now, for my text compressor. Basically to separate the code from my Editor for anyone who wants to mess with it. It only supports GS2, because I still didn't add the addresses/etc. for the other games.
January 14, 2018, 05:01:00 PM
Fox: Okay! Going to need to think how I want it to work. Initial thoughts is maybe have a number of arguments in the filepath thing. And have a number of shortcuts (files) to be used as examples. Assuming there are no problems.
January 14, 2018, 10:38:24 AM
KyleRunner: Well... I'm used to editing text ina a text editor, so... yes! Thanks in advance!
January 13, 2018, 11:38:43 PM
Fox: (Text editor = Text Document like notepad.)
January 13, 2018, 11:38:21 PM
Fox: Would you prefer during the text editing in a text editor? (Like what gstoolkit lets you do?) I could probably make a separate tool or something to compress it.
January 13, 2018, 10:10:02 PM
KyleRunner: Ok. Once I finish my Lost Age translation, I'll try a Mario Golf one. Thanks. (But I'll need help).
January 13, 2018, 10:03:17 PM
Fox: If you want to make it "permanent" (part of a hack), then you'd edit code in the ROM that writes to this location of the IDs you'd want to change. (You can find these locations by using a breakpoint debugger like SDL-H or no$gba.)
January 13, 2018, 10:00:11 PM
Fox: Reload/switch = Recommended to be done through Debug mode/warp menu, ofcourse... since doors seem to appear as if they were disabled? ; 03001238:01 and B+Start to get to warp menu.
January 13, 2018, 09:55:39 PM
Fox: @Kyle Runner = It might be, but you'd have to use the correct addresses for Mario Golf, rather than for GS2 as I have it right now. ; @raijinken = Yes. 02000454 = ID of leader. (Change this and reload/switch room you are in, enjoy.)
January 13, 2018, 02:23:29 PM
raijinken: Hey guys, is it possible to somehow change the lead character on the map? Was wondering. I remember there was a cheat to use Jenna, but what if I wanted Isaac, or Piers?
January 13, 2018, 02:10:03 PM
KyleRunner: Hey, Fox *
January 13, 2018, 02:09:37 PM
KyleRunner: Hey, is your text editor compatible with Mario Golf (GBA)?
January 11, 2018, 08:33:13 PM
Fox: But if it isn't an oversight, I still can't imagine it being that useful.
January 11, 2018, 08:28:24 PM
Fox: part, ofcourse.
January 11, 2018, 08:28:15 PM
Fox: 0200274C = Hmm... Stuff happens here when you use Cyclone around bushes. (These cause tile replacements, and setting event 0 to those tiles.) - And I guess this kept here so it can be scanned after battle. (To re-update the map.) So here is my fun thought (assuming if it is even possible, or even convenient if so.) ... Are there any events from other maps that could be disabled do to using Cyclone on bushes + Retreat glitch? I'll need to do some testing to make sure this isn't an oversight on my

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