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Author Topic: [RELEASE] Golden Sun Reloaded  (Read 119402 times)
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I need saves to test encounters in GS Reloaded!

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« Reply #435 on: January 26, 2019, 10:41:19 PM »

Quote
The whole Fire Breath thing
The only reason Fire Breath is Fire, is cause it fits with the theme of the class and since it's only a mid tier spell the element never bothered me.

Quote
I'm trying to RNG Drop a Virtuous Armlet
From a quick glance it seems you're not adding turn RN (1x each enemy)

Quote
Spirit Armlet legitimately before Isaac's gang rejoins with Felix's? Jenna would love the extra Venus power
Spirit Armlet is sold at Loho. For Venus boosts you have the bone armlet in the Western Sea

BTW i'm reworking bonuses from equipment after the recent suggestions i've read here and that Role sent me.
Mostly a rebalance to the power level of Shirts Rings and Shoes and of the boosts to Agility, Crits and Ailments.
Nothing major though, just tweaking the numbers.
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« Reply #436 on: January 26, 2019, 11:15:26 PM »

I figured the turn actions and Monster Actions were considered the same RN numbers (1RN for their turn total regardless of actions). However, monsters like the Magicore seem to prove otherwise with AoE Psynergy. I went to Tundaria SUPER early in hopes of RNG'ing a Mystery Glove, in addition to snagging Wheeze. Thus far, I've gotten nothing.
Lv.24 everyone in base class lines
First Strike vs Magicore + Minotaurus (1RN)

Sheba casts Tornado on Magicore (+4RNs)
Jenna casts Debilitate (+2RNs)
Felix casts Bravery on Piers (+1RN)
Piers casts Hail Prims on Magicore (+4RNs)

Turn 2 (+2RNs)
Magicore casts Cycle Beam hitting Sheba and Piers (+4RNs?)
Minotaurus attacks Piers (+1RN?)
Sheba casts Tornado (+4RNs)
Jenna casts Impair on Magicore (+1RN)
Felix casts Ragnarok on Magicore (+2RNs)
Piers unleashes Fog on Magicore (+3RNs +1RN for Delude chance?)
Magicore Dies (+1RN for a possible? total of 31RNs on death)

Turns after kill Minotaurus
No Mystery Glove.

I've tried a whole bunch of other things for Turn 2, but it either ends up with no Mystery Gloves or the Magicore not dying. I might go to Treasure Island to rig a Crystal Rod for Sheba and a Sylph Feather or three to forge a Sylph Rapier for Felix and maybe Piers, along with a Faerie's Vest for Jenna.

Ah, Spirit Armlet's locked at Loho? Kind of a shame, considering Virtuous Armlet is available for MUCH longer. I don't think I'm strong enough to give up Dual Wishing just yet, especially with the Serpent coming up fast, so the Virtuous Armlet might not see much use.

I look forward to seeing the tweaks you're implementing! Happy


EDIT:
So, I tried rigging a Mystery Glove to drop on my completed file to see if it's worth going after, but it's not dropping?

First Strike against Magicore + 2 Minotauruses (+1RN)
Jenna uses Sleep Card (+3RNs), Sleeps both Minotauruses
Piers uses Ester Wood (+8RNs)
Garet uses Tempest (+6RNs)
Mia uses Poison Flow (+6RNs) poisons Magicore and middle Minotaurus (does this add any extra RNs?)

Turn 2 (+3RNs)
Jenna uses Gel/Serac/Hail (+3RNs) on Magicore, killing it (+1RN)
Rest of party defends
Minotaurus A dies of Venom
Minotaurus B is Asleep.

Turn 3
Minotaurus B gets killed

Vial is dropped.

Were the Mystery Gloves removed from the Magicores or am I doing the RN Math wrong?

EDIT 2:
Never mind the last sentence of my previous edit. I got a Mystery Glove to Drop. I did the same thing, but had Mia cast Dire Inferno instead of Poison Flow. I think the Minotaurus dying from Venom somehow overwrote the Mystery Gloves guaranteed drop? It's weird, but that aside I got my answer about the Mystery Gloves. I think I'll get a couple so the girls can hit harder with elements besides Mercury/Venus, while still keeping some extra Mercury/Venus Power so they're at least healing HP equal or close to the base power of their MT Heals.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2019, 12:13:50 AM by Average Wind Seer » Logged
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« Reply #437 on: January 27, 2019, 12:04:35 AM »

You can easily check drops with the Golden Sun Editor: you dropped a Vial from a Minotaur, so you're doing something wrong. Stick to healing, psynergy and buffing for manipulating RN, no need to make things more complicated.

BTW i just tested drops and there's a minor issue with certain djinn (those that reduce atk-def-res as a side effect). Those djinns add 1 RN more compared to vanilla. Easily fixed by using another djinn or by compensating for that 1 RN more by using different abilities.
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« Reply #438 on: January 27, 2019, 12:21:15 AM »

I was using Poison Flow because I wasn't sure if Dire Inferno would kill the Magicore too soon.

Huh. that's a peculiar bug. I suppose that's handy to know in case I hit spots where I'd be one RN Short with a normal Djinni kill. I'll give the Magicore + Minotaurus another spin in my HM file to see if I can get it to drop Mystery Gloves.

EDIT:
Gave up on trying to rig Mystery Gloves, and I can't get a Crystal Rod or Sylph Feather to drop. I think the issue as of now is that my party is simply too slow to use RNG manipulation. I can't outspeed any of the enemies I'm trying to RNG abuse, and that greatly screws with the RNs, since I can't tell if the Monsters' actions add RN values or not.

Do you know if the Guaranteed Drop RN Value was changed or not? because with the bug that has Stat Debuffing Djinn add an RN Value, I'm getting Mystery Gloves on 32RN in my completed file, using the strategy in my last post (with Mia using Dire Inferno instead of Poison Flow).

Huh... that's really bizarre... in the encounter I listed for my completed file, I get the Mystery Gloves if Mia casts Dire Inferno which leads to Garet killing the middle Minotaurus via Tempest. BUT if she casts Fiery Abyss instead, the middle Minotaurus survives Garet's Tempest, and I don't get the Mystery Gloves, even though I should have the same number of RNs at the time of killing the Magicore with Hail (32RNs). I REALLY don't understand TLA's RNG...
« Last Edit: January 27, 2019, 02:49:51 AM by Average Wind Seer » Logged
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« Reply #439 on: January 27, 2019, 10:32:47 AM »

Just read this thoroughly: https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/gba/561356-golden-sun-the-lost-age/faqs/25734

There's no way you can't drop stuff if you stick to it. More so if you don't use stat-debuffing djinn for the kill (due to the +1 RN bug)
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« Reply #440 on: January 27, 2019, 01:08:49 PM »

Reading that is how I learned that enemies are guaranteed to add extra RNs, regardless if they get a chance to act or not, unlike TBS (i think?).

Oddly enough, using Hail, a Stat Debuffing Djinni, is the one who scored the Mystery Gloves for me. But for whatever reason, if Minotaurus A survives the Preemptive Strike, I don't get the Mystery Gloves, despite having the same number of RNs. (+1RN extra in Turn 1 due to Minotaurus A dying and +2 at the start of Turn 2 for 2 Monsters living, vs +0RN extra in Turn 1 and +3RN in Turn 2 for 3 Monsters living.) That part just doesn't make any sense to me at all.

EDIT:
I think I have an idea of what's going on. I'm guessing the RNG, or whatever system determines which monster drops their item, is checking if Minotaurus A, the Middle Monster of the enemy formation, dies on the 31st/32nd RN if it's still on the field by the time the 31/32RN Kill comes around. Death by Poison must not add an RN value, because doing the strategy I've listed previously with Mia using Poison Flow instead of Dire Inferno in Turn 1, I get a guaranteed Vial Drop, which is the Minotaurus Drop Item. I'm not entirely sure about this, but it's the best explanation I can think of why one method of 32RN Drop gets me the Mystery Gloves, but two others either get me nothing or a Vial.

Also I tried doing this method with Fog (meaning 31RNs at Magicore death), and got nothing each time. I think something bugged and bumped the guaranteed drop RN Value to 32, or Fog is one of the bugged Djinn that add an extra RN and Hail isn't. I can test to see which other Mercury Djinn produce the Mystery Gloves and which ones don't, if you'd like.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2019, 07:28:23 PM by Average Wind Seer » Logged
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« Reply #441 on: January 29, 2019, 01:07:34 AM »

Yeah, I just made equipment and weapons drops 1:1 and threw away the extras. I treat rare drops as unique items anyways, so pitching the extras just works. Grinding out rare drops adds xp and RNG manip adds hard resets, frustration, and too much djinn rearrangement to make sure everyone is fast enough for just one item, imo.
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« Reply #442 on: January 29, 2019, 01:18:09 AM »

Yeah, I'm gonna do something like that. Use a cheat to force Mystery Gloves and a Crystal Rod to drop. Being too slow to even have a chance to outspeed the monsters I'm abusing, and given that I've got proof that 31RNs doesn't guarantee the drop in this mod (all stat-debuffing Mercury Djinn net me a Mystery Glove at 32RN in my RNG Manipulation Testing Encounter with a Magicore and two Minotauruses thanks to their bugged extra RN value, but Fog, Serac, and Mist don't cause the Mystery Gloves to drop), I don't think I'll be able to get these pieces of equipment at a reasonable time for them to be worth getting under more normal circumstances.

EDIT:
So, I spawned a couple of Mystery Gloves into Sheba's inventory, and I noticed that they're defensively weaker than the Virtuous Armlet, which you'd get sooner according to Cerberus being 2 levels lower than Magicore, meaning you'd go to Ankolh Ruins before Tundaria Tower. This kinda contradicts the Golden Rule you stated on the first post of this thread, that new equipment is always statistically/generally better than old equipment, but it's only a minor gripe. If you decide to change this, a simple fix would be to swap Cerberus' and Magicore's drop item, so you're more likely to get the Mystery Gloves first.


* Golden Sun - The Lost Age [patched]-0001.jpg (55.99 KB, 480x320 - viewed 73 times.)

* Golden Sun - The Lost Age [patched]-0000.jpg (50.06 KB, 480x320 - viewed 80 times.)
« Last Edit: January 29, 2019, 01:44:29 AM by Average Wind Seer » Logged
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« Reply #443 on: January 29, 2019, 04:16:37 PM »

EDIT:
So, I spawned a couple of Mystery Gloves into Sheba's inventory, and I noticed that they're defensively weaker than the Virtuous Armlet, which you'd get sooner according to Cerberus being 2 levels lower than Magicore, meaning you'd go to Ankolh Ruins before Tundaria Tower. This kinda contradicts the Golden Rule you stated on the first post of this thread, that new equipment is always statistically/generally better than old equipment, but it's only a minor gripe. If you decide to change this, a simple fix would be to swap Cerberus' and Magicore's drop item, so you're more likely to get the Mystery Gloves first.

The Golden Rule is valid when comparing items of the same type. Gloves have inherently weaker defense than Bracelets acquired in the same point of the game, like long swords and light blades, or heavy armor and robes
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« Reply #444 on: January 29, 2019, 05:34:49 PM »

Alrighty. Though due to the Mystery Gloves being available later than the Virtuous Armlet and when farming Star Dusts becomes available, the Mystery Gloves are completely pointless. Both guys have the Luna Shield for PP Regen and the Planet Armor if they want extra Elemental Power, while the girls would rather have the Virtuous Armlet for stronger offense under their Jupiter/Mars classlines, or Sheba would rather have the Clear Bracelet for stronger Wishing.

Speaking of Star Dust items, the Comet Mace is REALLY bad, to the point where it's not worth even considering getting. The Astral Circlets and Luna Shields alone take higher priority for use of the three free Star Dusts you get, and by the time you can farm Living Armors for more, you have the Demon's Mace, the Mist Saber, and the Rusty Longsword from Aqua Rock. Even if you did decide to get it instead of Astral Circlets or Luna Shields, Aqua Rock REALLY knocks down its usefulness since Mercury Power is the least desirable thing on your warriors at that point. Plus Sheba likely has the Cloud Wand at this point, which is more useful thanks to the MaxPP Boost.

Anywho, I finally beat Gaia's Rock on HM, but that damn Serpent managed to get off an Instant Kill Mighty Press on Sheba RIGHT before he died... bastard... Fury

EDIT:
tacking this bit onto this post to avoid double posting-

Which of Jenna's tri-element Classes are supposed to parallel Ivan's/Mia's/Sheba's Tri-Element classes? I know Guardian is Pure Mage, and I'm pretty certain Incantrix equals Fateweaver. But I can't tell if Heretic or Valkyrie was supposed to parallel Fury and the other Worldwaker. Though Heretic and Valkyrie strongly feel like Fury was broken into two separate classes for Jenna, Heretic coming away rather okay, but Valkyrie suffering so horribly it feels like a rushed/unfinished class. two EPAs and ONE Attack Psynergy is all Valkyrie has, making it easily Jenna's worst Class. I really don't have any clue what your goal was with Valkyrie, but as it is, there's absolutely no reason to use it.
As it stands, Jenna's best parallel to Fury is Pierrot, which isn't a good thing.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2019, 10:36:43 PM by Average Wind Seer » Logged
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« Reply #445 on: January 30, 2019, 12:07:20 AM »

Don't try to force parallels. Valkyrie is obviously the mage warrior hybrid like Fury, Jonin and General are, but it's more defensive while Fury is all about offense.

Valkyrie is easily the worst caster among mages and has lowish attack (even though it's only 5% less than Fury) but can: Revive, ST Heal, Debuff (with EPAs), Buff, Break and heal ailments. It's unparalleled at support.

Incantatrix is... and oddball. If this wasn't golden sun it'd be an anti-mage mage that can do a bit of everything. Sort of like a master of magic (that's the concept behind it). The rest can easily be seen: highest PP multiplier paired with Fume, AOE healing, self sustain with the drains, ward, weaken and bind for support. The best parallel would be calling it a Mars Arcanist.

Heretic is Fury in pure caster form: all on offense. Second best offensive caster (190% + Punishment) right behind Necromancer (190% + Call Dullahan).

Guardian: Venus Pure mage. Nuff said.
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« Reply #446 on: January 30, 2019, 12:27:41 AM »

Hmm... I see.

Does replacing Cure Poison and Restore into Remedy free up a Psynergy slot? Because if so, I think Valkyrie would benefit greatly from a Quick Strike-type Psynergy or something like Fury's Rolling Fire, to fill in the free slot.

Incantrix really is an oddball. It does indeed look useful, but I can't really think of a scenario of when I'd use it outside of boss battles. Sadly, Bind probably won't be any good against bosses lol

I might use Jenna as a Cursed Heretic this time around, though that means Sheba/Ivan and Mia will likely shoved into Wishing Classes to make up for Jenna's lack of an AoE heal.

Guardian is just fantastic. A very fantastic class.

While on the topic of Jenna's classes, would it be possible to replace Miko's Thorn with Punji? The Thorn Psynergy line is pretty weak, though it's clear that Jenna's Miko Classline is inspired by Himi's Venus Classline, so I can understand if you'd rather not change it.

Also I came up with more ideas for a 4th Item Class, if you're still interested in making one.
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« Reply #447 on: January 30, 2019, 05:21:32 PM »

Does replacing Cure Poison and Restore into Remedy free up a Psynergy slot? Because if so, I think Valkyrie would benefit greatly from a Quick Strike-type Psynergy or something like Fury's Rolling Fire, to fill in the free slot.
Yes but i don't think i will for balance reasons. Jack of all trades shouldn't have access to the highest tiers.

While on the topic of Jenna's classes, would it be possible to replace Miko's Thorn with Punji? The Thorn Psynergy line is pretty weak, though it's clear that Jenna's Miko Classline is inspired by Himi's Venus Classline, so I can understand if you'd rather not change it.
Same as above, but i also have an excel sheet where i tried to balance offense and heal for each MT healer

As for the 4th item class i have no plans to make one for the time being
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« Reply #448 on: January 30, 2019, 05:56:34 PM »

If you consider Remedy a highest tiered Psynergy, I'm a little confused by that, considering I had very little reason, if any, to use Remedy towards the end of the game. If a Quick-Strike type Psynergy or something like Rolling Fire are considered highest tiered Psynergy, then perhaps Valkyrie could have a third debuffing EPA? If I remember right, Odyssey lowers Defense while Plume Edge lowers attack. If not a debuffing EPA, then perhaps Planetary could be her third EPA? Without something for raw physical damage like Fury got with Rolling Fire and Planetary, Valkyrie just lacks purpose for any team, since most other Mage Classes fill that supportive role FAR better with larger PP Pools, along with better ways to deal damage when Support isn't needed.

I don't really see how keeping Thorn over Punji is for balance purposes when Sheba under Mercury is doing huge damage with Shine Plasma and Ice Horn, both almost as strong as Unleashes around the middle to end of the Eastern Sea.

That's a shame about the 4th Item Class, but understandable, considering you'd have to code it from scratch.

EDIT:
I figured I should give my point of view on Support Classes to better explain my disappointment with Valkyrie.

In my opinion, a good/"ultimate" support class has valuable support skills that ONLY THEY can use.
The Bard and Chemist Jobs from Final Fantasy 5 are probably my favorite examples of great support classes that aren't dedicated healers.

Bards can put HP Regen on the entire party within a single turn at zero MP Cost, while other Jobs would need multiple turns to do the same while using a fair amount of MP or rather rare items. Bard can also drastically increase the party's stats given enough time, but nothing of value is lost should the battle end sooner than expected. Chemist can do the same through its Mix Command, but a prematurely ended battle leads to a waste of some very precious Mixing items.

Meanwhile Chemist has a whole array of supportive capabilities through their Mix command, many of which can ONLY be done through Mixing. A Chemist can grant a Buff to any party member that amplifies ALL Elemental Damage they put out. They can place Berserk, Haste, and Image (a special buff that flat out negates 2 physical attacks to the character) on a party member with a single turn.

They may seem overpowered, however neither Job will be able to take on the entire game themself.

I believe that if you want Valkyrie to be an "Ultimate" Support type class, then she needs something(s) that ONLY she can do, and for that thing(s) to be considerably useful.

Heck, my new ideas for the 4th Item Class were intended for making an Ultimate Support-type Class, as it would have very few direct attacks, but a multitude of Supportive Buffs that only it could do (outside of Djinn and Summoning).
« Last Edit: January 31, 2019, 02:05:54 AM by Average Wind Seer » Logged
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« Reply #449 on: February 01, 2019, 09:29:56 PM »

I meant highest tier in its own category, you can see i haven't given the upgrade to Remedy to all those who have access to CP+Restore.
There is merit on what you say about the valkyrie though, so i'm considering 1-2 buffs to it, but it won't be easy considering how picky i am.

BTW i know i'm partial to jenna so i'd like to hear opinion on piers' classes as well
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June 16, 2019, 06:54:57 AM
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Fox: I wonder if Atrius would be interested in how my map editor would be shaping up... even if it is a bit.... messy.  - As for Textcomp being compatible with more games.... maybe some day = I would like to do that...., but it isn't on my priority list right now, unfortunately. :(   
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ryancaesar12345: and how to change a elemtal color like steam normal violet change to blue?
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ryancaesar12345: i saw in reloaded too many icon replace or changes and shade and flash decrease block damage 60 and 90 to 50 and 60 i think summon % hp damage decrease class separation change the treasure items the effects are change 
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Fox: Another thing about the Separation Patch and why we need PC based class type charts = With Atrius's patch = If you set all eLevels to 0, ... then when you get djinn of just one type, and each PC becomes something... well... Jenna/Piers would have the same base classes as Felix/Sheba... ... but this is concept-wise to show that something may be given up.....
May 25, 2019, 02:12:36 PM
Fox: "overwritting it" I mean the data in the buffer... not the originally file you loaded. - That only ever gets overwriting via the Save/Save As buttons.)
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Fox: I thought maybe I would need to clarify.  - gsmagic is my experiment editor.  It can be found on this forum. (e.g. http://forum.goldensunhacking.net/index.php?topic=2805.0 has it, but is not the latest version of my editor.) ; Those patches - applying them is for making them easier to edit via a hex editor.... Since originally it is done in assembly... a bit of a mess for editing.... , so those patches turn that data into table(s).... ; When I say "hex editor" = No, I don't mean to use the 
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ryancaesar12345: i dont understand a thing simple success rate and simple summon  .ips files how to understand? by patch in original rom and view in gs tla editor?
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ryancaesar12345: gsmagic? what is that and is that a editor where i can download that?
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Fox: gsmagic only really supports GS2 (U) as well... While there is minor support for GS1 (Mainly to view maps), can't really say it counts yet.
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Foxhttp://forum.goldensunhacking.net/index.php?action=downloads;sa=view;down=59 = And the Simple Summons thing... (Hex editor experience expected..) ... For all three of the hex editor experience stuff... I mean just basic knowledge should be enough to get by.

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