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Baransu
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« on: 06, April, 2017, 01:14:15 PM »

Hello guys, I'm Baransu.

I've been following this site for quite sometime ever since the release of the editor but never really got around to joining it until now.

There's quite a few patches on this site that i'm interested in playing around with such as the Intellect patch as I like the idea of having a dedicated offense stat for mages since they never really scaled properly to endgame and the PP patch doesn't scale them as evenly as I'd hope. Not too keen about the hex editing part but it shouldn't be too hard once I get the hang of it.

I'm definitely looking forward to be a part of this community.
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« Reply #1 on: 06, April, 2017, 08:29:56 PM »

Hey there, welcome!

It's pretty nice to know that you are interested in the Intellect patch! I would just keep in mind that I think I forgot to update the enemy AI to accommodate it so enemy behaviour when using the related buffs/debuff and Break effects may be a little off, but other than that it still works pretty well for its purpose.

It'll be great to have you here I'm sure, and don't hesitate to ask for help if you need it!
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Baransu
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« Reply #2 on: 08, April, 2017, 05:59:42 AM »

I've been using your Intellect patch and its working out fairly well so far in terms of expected damage. However whenever I use the buffs, the game displays wrong values compared to amount that the character is supposed to be receiving. The debuffs on the other hand seem to work out alright although they wear off a little too quickly for my liking.

One other question, is there any particular order in which I should apply these patches? For example would using the Intellect patch cause any other patch to break/not work properly?


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« Reply #3 on: 09, April, 2017, 01:42:12 AM »

Huh, that's weird. I may have forgotten to correct an error in there somewhere; I'll check later.

As for the debuff effects, how quickly do they wear off compared to the Attack debuffs? If I recall correctly they are supposed to have the same likelihood of wearing off at 30%, so if they tend to wear off sooner than Attack then I may have made a calculation error there as well.

Particular order: Not that I can think of. I know for my patches I usually try to describe a proper order if there is one on the download pages but there is always the possibility that they won't function 100% properly with patches that other people make. I also try to make mine compatible with each other, barring the odd exception. Which patches are you applying?
« Last Edit: 09, April, 2017, 02:15:50 AM by Lord Squirtle » Logged

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Baransu
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« Reply #4 on: 09, April, 2017, 01:44:32 PM »

They're supposed wear off at a rate of 30%? Strange because they tend to wear off within 1-2 turns of application.

As for the patches that I plan on using, I'm considering:
5% Stat Increments
Reflux Unlimited
Simple Success Rates
Enemy Specific Immunities
Animation Overhaul
Advanced Reviving
Wave Animation
Intellect Patch

If possible, I'd like to come up with a way to nerf the HP% damage that summons, and a way to completely separate Jenna and Piers' classes from Felix/Sheba since they'd crossover at high djinn levels.
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« Reply #5 on: 09, April, 2017, 06:03:24 PM »

We've kinda already done that last one.  Most common approach is to drop the damage form 3% per djinn to 2% per djinn.  Some even lock stronger summons behind later turns, though some of us (myself included) think that goes a bit too far.
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Baransu
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« Reply #6 on: 09, April, 2017, 06:20:49 PM »

I'm assuming that there's a patch that makes nerfing summons a thing then?

On a side note, it seems as if setting the intellect equivalents to be 20% higher than their physical counterparts is ideal in terms of letting mages deal comparable damage to physical characters. I'd definitely need to do a heavy overhaul in terms of equipment progression and availability since I didn't really like how physical characters could use every weapon type except for Staves/Ankhs in TLA along with the fact that the stuff from Lemuria were overall better than anything you could buy for a very long time. I'm also looking at revamping spells a bit (particular pp costs and power) since there's a lot of redundant/underused spells.
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« Reply #7 on: 10, April, 2017, 08:13:02 PM »

There is the Simple Summons patch, which replaces the function the game uses now with a byte table where you change the added damage values.

For class separation, you'll either need to use the editor setting or code around it to avoid the editor overwriting your changes. Not really sure how the editor handles that, and it's one of the more annoying features but little can be done unless a fix is made for it.


As for the turn/duration bit, would you mind testing something for me? #08FB8A00 has an instruction to use the value xA5, would you mind changing that to xA4 and then checking to see if anything changes? This part of the code calculates the RAM address of the buff/debuff values and I think I may have accidentally entered the wrong value here.

I'll check the text thing later!


Balance setting: That's good to know. I noticed originally when testing that psynergy either started out the same or weaker, but gradually grew stronger as you progress through the game. Still not quite as strong as warriors in most cases but an improvement all the same.
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« Reply #8 on: 10, April, 2017, 08:41:41 PM »

^ Yes, Simple Summons if you want to go down to 2% (With some hex editing of that table...) - Prior to the patch/as it was in original code... I'm guessing it was an optimized switch statement... those can look pretty cluttered in compiled format. (Small switch statements may leave out a pointer table, while larger switch statements include them?)

Atrius's Class Separation Patch only divides the two parties.... so yes, you'll need to code something in... The patch Atrius's inserts is very simply, though... (Probably only like ~4 or so instructions, but I forget.)
Which amounts to... if PC is in second party (PC id >= 4), then add 20 to class type.... and then compares that number with the class types in all the classes to figure out which class you'll be getting. ...
To separate them for each character, it could be as simple as pc id * 20 ... But I not sure if anyone is interested in have a ka-billion different classes with the amount of time and effort it could take to make??


@A5 to A4 ... No, I think that's already correct... you're suppose to get the PC # so you can set the arg for this function:
Quote
080AFFAC = get_elemental_levels(pc,pcDjinnRamAddr,sp) pc can be 0-7 for PCs, or 8+ for enemies.; Return 0.
Which in the Intellect patch, should return the total of all elemental levels. (No longer is 0.)
Now days, I'm kind of curious if calling that function was a good idea or not....?  .... Hm.... I figured it doesn't matter much.
« Last Edit: 10, April, 2017, 09:02:58 PM by Fox » Logged

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« Reply #9 on: 10, April, 2017, 09:13:03 PM »

Oh yeah, oops! It's been a while; I'll check that again later.
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Baransu
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« Reply #10 on: 11, April, 2017, 01:29:35 AM »

I'm only really interested in completely separating Jenna and Piers from their counterparts since Felix and Sheba only really warrant having a different base class compared to Isaac/Garet although the problem of having to copy paste the stats over still exists. Maybe I can look at one of the hacks on this site and see some possible solutions for it.
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« Reply #11 on: 11, April, 2017, 04:39:10 PM »

Makes sense!


One more question for you; what are the Luck stats of the characters recovering from the Intellect debuffs?
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Baransu
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« Reply #12 on: 11, April, 2017, 11:11:59 PM »

Luck is based off total element level right? Then its 9 on Sheba/Jenna/Piers and 8 on Felix, while their vanilla luck stat turned agility is 7/4/6/3 on Sheba/Jenna/Piers/Felix respectively.
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« Reply #13 on: 12, April, 2017, 03:37:02 AM »

Sounds good. No equipment bonuses either I assume?


I'm going to be kinda busy over the next couple days or so, but I'll try to squeeze a fix or at least a little research into my schedule soon. You can check around #08124828 if you're familiar with thumb/assembly at all, since the code that checks the Intellect buffs should be around here. If not then that will be the first thing I look into (I have VBA open and everything)!
« Last Edit: 12, April, 2017, 03:40:45 AM by Lord Squirtle » Logged

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Baransu
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« Reply #14 on: 12, April, 2017, 04:51:20 AM »

Take your time, no real rush on my end for you get this fixed right away when most of the stats and stuff for the hack need to be planned out, not to mention that patches need to be applied to the rom.

The only equipment bonuses were +10 HP and +50 Wind Resist on Felix and +15 Wind Power on Sheba. I had set the Intellect buff to Wind but I don't think that has anything to do with it right?

I'm currently trying to figure out how to balance out equipment now that Intellect's an actual stat and Agility got revised to be a single digit stat like Luck was. Not quite sure if a weapon type that buffs agility would be a wise idea in this system unless the light blade characters had lower agility modifiers overall barring Ivan.
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« Reply #15 on: 12, April, 2017, 07:13:03 AM »

Sounds good!

Wind: I doubt it; I mostly just wanted to double check in case you also added the ailment resistance value to any of the gear you had equipped because that gets added as a flat value used in the same way that the original luck stat is used.

Agility: Well, that depends on whether you want to keep the stat a single digit thing or not. It can technically go as high as 255 and still function the same way that the original agility value does. Same goes for stat growths, assuming they remain functional of course!

My personal recommendation would be to boost agility values by at least a little bit so you have more of a stat to work with when balancing enemies for your hack, but only if you feel you can do it well.
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Baransu
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« Reply #16 on: 12, April, 2017, 11:36:24 AM »

Well Agility going up to 255 makes things easier for me to handle then, since I can just divide everyone's agility stat by whatever the difference between the old and new caps were. My biggest worry is hitting the Intellect stat cap since I multiply the bonus that other stats would get by 4 in order to make the one for it.

For weapons, I'll think I go for:
Swords: Atk, pure element where applicable
Axes: Atk, -Def
Staves: Atk, Int, PP
Blades: Atk, Defense, Agility
Maces: Atk, HP, Int, Power, Res
Ankh: Atk, PP, Int, Power, Res
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« Reply #17 on: 14, April, 2017, 10:24:56 AM »

Man, I wish we could add other effects to weapon types, too.  I've always liked the idea of different weapons having different passives - for instance, Maces dealing 10% of any physical damage they do to PP as well, or Ankhs reducing any inbound Int-based or summon damage by 10%, and maybe Blades giving a chance of giving a character's action priority.  Don't think we can do that, though.
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« Reply #18 on: 14, April, 2017, 03:06:41 PM »

Baransu: Yeah, I could see that being an issue. The option of not doing it that way always exists, but then there will be times when you have points that don't go into anything.

Weapons (a): I like it! Simple enough to understand how each weapon type is themed but not too simple to make it boring.

Weapons (b): A lot of those ideas could probably be implemented with some work, but making it so they can be customized easily may be tricky.
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« Reply #19 on: 14, April, 2017, 08:17:55 PM »

-Maces dealing 10% of any physical damage they do to PP as well

Not sure if I'd call them Damage Types or not... but I could see a possibility in adding more types. (also assuming ability effects are based on chance values....)
The unfortunate part is Atrius's editor would need to be modified to support editing it beyond the current last damage type. (If you don't want to use a hex editor)... or a different editor could be made.. (Such as my own.)

-Ankhs reducing any inbound Int-based or summon damage by 10%
And this one could just be an addition to the Summon damage type. / Etc. ... Unless there are (for example) two different types of summons where one is suppose to ignore Ankhs, then we could just have another damage type here as well... (With the Ankh-resistance built in.)
« Last Edit: 14, April, 2017, 08:32:18 PM by Fox » Logged

Golden Sun Docs: Broken Seal - The Lost Age - Dark Dawn | Mario Sports Docs: Mario Golf & Mario Tennis | Misc. Docs
Refer to Yoshi's Lighthouse for any M&L hacking needs...

Sometimes I like to compare apples to oranges. (Figuratively) ... They are both fruits, but which one would you eat more? (If taken literally, I'd probably choose apples.)
Maybe it is over-analyzing, but it doesn't mean the information is useless.


The only GS Discord servers with significance are:
Golden Sun Hacking Community
GS Speedrunning
/r/Golden Sun
GS United Nations
Temple of Kraden

Can you believe how small the Golden Sun Community is?

2+2=5 Don't believe me? Those are rounded decimal numbers. Take that, flat earth theorists! :)
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31, August, 2020, 08:40:32 AM
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Daddy Poi's Oily Gorillas: (The simplest being to not accept char IDs pass 255, I think.)
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