Recommendations for a Strategy Version.

[Ehic]

I checked gamefaqs Boards and apparently only the targets luck counts.

Still waiting for input on Classes and Jamie I read your old topic and liked the idea for Piers.

[thenightsshadow]

Shameless plug:

Check this post for any Djinni-related concerns and plausible fixes.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessage.php?board=561356&topic=51485211

[Rolina]

So I want to make a "balanced" more strategic version of Golden Sun. My biggest aim is to not make a hack and heal like the original. Some of my current ideas on how to accomplish this are:
-Make weapon types more distinct and balance
-Rework the unleash system for certain weapon types
-Give alot of weapons and armor use abilites (not sure if they should be breakable)
-Rework range elemental attacks to balance with elemental physical attacks
-Make psynergy more varied (no more 3 spell trees that vary only slightly by base power; i.e. gaia, thorn, growth)
-Enemy reworking

Any recommendations on how to accomplish this or other areas that should be changed?

I've already made suggestions for weapons, and for unleashes as well.  See the appropriate GSDG topic.
Same goes for armor and what not.
Psynergy ideas can be found in their appropriate GSDG topic
Same with enemies.

As such, if you need any ideas, why not check them out?  I know at least I happen to be taking them seriously.  So long  as you ignore those pervasive joke and cameo items that show up and look at the ones that people took seriously, you should be fine.

[Ehic]

I've actually already stolen some ideas from there (especially weapon balancing), I read through gamefaqs plenty also. I was just wandering if anyone had any other opinions that hadn't been shared.

[Rolina]

Well, are you turning this into an SRPG like the title suggests?  That suggests that you're using something like the FFTA or TO system, in which case you may need to find out a totally new way to balance AoE for psynergy.

[Ehic]

Sorry but i don't understand your abbreviating, please explain?

I want redesign the curent game so that it's no longer a slash and heal, is fairly more difficult, and so you have to make choices (no more just buy the newest weapons and use the most recent djinn). I want the player to actually think ahead and have a plan especially for bosses.

[Rolina]

SRPG is a Strategy Role Playing Game.  They're games like Final Fantasy Tactics, Final Fantasy Tactics Advance, Tactics Ogre, Luminous Arc, Disgaea, etc..., and typically use an Isometric grid for the placement of combat units/characters...

Otherwise, there's nothing about it that involves "Strategy".  If you're not going that route, then what you're speaking about isn't adding strategy, it's rebalancing the game's system, which we're all doing.

[Ehic]

By strategy I meant make it so that not all bosses can be easily beaten by attack and heal, unless the player decides to level grind. Similar to dragon quest 8 where the game could be beaten with hack and heal but only if you farily over leveled, but at level or below level would require planning like exploiting a boss with abnormally high HP and low luck by using poison then just defend and heal till it kills itself.

[Aile~♥]

You could make a boss with abnormally high Defence and immunity to Psynergy, and also abnormally low HP, so that summons don't work, most Djinn don't work, and Psynergy doesn't work, but also give the boss low luck, and high Attack, so that Djinn like Mold and status effects are especially dangerous.

[Rolina]

Actually, that's just a basic rebalanced game...  Not so much strategy, as balanced gameplay.

[Ehic]

Ok, thanks for help.

Class rebalancing (up to lvl 54, normal equipment): What Class lines do you believe are (over/under)powered, why, and how can that be fixed?

ie. Ninja: Has extremely high attack and agility while all other stats are above average. Has an EPA that hits three targets and an another EPA that can stun. Can be fixed by lowering attack to good from very good and defence from good to average.

[Charon]

The Jupiter base class is so pathetic. They seriously need to have better stats and Psynergies.

I was thinking, maybe the electrical based Jupiter psynergies could have a paralyzing effect to them?... That would make them far more useful.

[Salanewt]

Oh yeah, I like that idea. However, I would not do this to Plasma (or Thunderclap) series. The Ray and Bolt series would be neat though.

Also...

Have a nice day.

[Sajin]

But, if psynergies get a side effect like stun than they have to be weakened otherwise you can simply spam, for example, destruct ray over and over and the enemies will always be stunned.
And didn't Jamie already give the idea of adding status effect to psynergies?

[Frog]

Well perhaps you give the psynergies a 10% chance of stun... wait, that's possible right?

Besides most of the electrical based psynergies are already extremely weak.

[Sajin]

Nope. It's not possible to giva an exact % to inflict stun/poison/etc. You can only set it to "May cause Stun". I guess it depends on the enemy's and/or caster's Luck only.

[Aile~♥]

Different attacks have different chances of causing stun. Want a high chance? Set it to the same effect as Paralyze. Want a lower chance? Then go find some other move.

We can set it to have the same chance as any move that already has it. But, we can't add our own chance or view the exact chance of it working.

[Ehic]

I been working on a way to balance damage/stauts hybrid psynergy, What other classes are unbalanced? Opinions on warlock being improved, also I'm looking into making mage multi element classes into fighter classes for Piers and in some cases Ivan. What classes do you think that could work for?

[Zach]

The Mysterious Card classes are underpowered, but I will get back to you, when I re-check how bad they were

[Rolina]

Personally, I think that Base classes should have more powerful psynergy, while the more mixed you get with djinn, the more the focus is on stats instead.

Basically, base classes are pure-psynergy oriented, meaning great EPAs for fighters, great base damage for mages.

Dual-element classes are a mix of the two.  Not as good of stats as tri-element, not as good of psynergy as base-class, but a healthy balance of the two.

Tri-element classes are more of a stat-focus.  They have psynergy to back them up, but it's not their primary means of damage, so it's kind of sub-par in comparison to other classes.  They make up for it by having the best overall stats, though.

The game TRIES to do this, but doesn't do it well enough... The Ninja class has not only the best stats in the game, but three of the best psynergies as well - Shurriken, Thunderhead, and Annihilation.


One way you can fix this is to have a 'staggered upgrade' system.  Basically, for attack spells in base classes, you'll learn spells like gaia without needing 4 djinn.  However, after you class up twice, the weaker stages get replaced with stronger versions that are learned at later levels.

For example, in Squire class, Quake is replaced by Tremor at Gallant.  It has the same range and animation as quake, but the power is one stage up from Quake Sphere, as is the level you learn it.  At Lord, Earthquake is replaced by High Tremor. Again, it's got the same range and animation as Earthquake, but the power and level learned are one step up from Tremor.  At Slayer, Quake Sphere is replaced by Grand Tremor, which has the same range and... well, you get the pattern.

This will keep adepts learning spells even beyond level 54, which is VERY helpful in terms of keeping psynergy balanced with unleashes.

This works with EPAs, too.  Ragnarok is learned as norm, and Odyssey is learned at twice the level, though rather than replacing Ragnarok, it just requires that you're Knight or higher.  At Gallant, Ragnarok is replaced by Laevateinn, which uses the same animation, but is stronger and learned at a higher level.  At Lord, Odyssey is replaced... by, let's say...  Iliad or something.  I'm sure you can come up with something better, as I'm drawing a blank.  Again, stronger, same animation, just learned at a higher level.

If you remember to pace your djinn right, it'll work perfectly for the "expected level".  If they're doing a LLG, then they're probably not gonna be using psynergy much anyways...


For Dual-element classes, they only go up to the second stage of replacement.  The 4, 6, and 8 djinn classes are what are used.  Unlike Base classes, only one Physical psynergy per fighter.  It DOES upgrade, though, at the 6-djinn class.

For Tri-element classes, they only go up the first stage.  IF that.  An alternative is that they don't go up at all, but rather have added effects so that psynergy is at least considered (such as, may cause poison, sleep, delude, lowers defense, etc...), which is something that I tend to lean towards.  Their main focus is stats, though.

For Item Classes, it honestly depends on the item.  They're as unique as the items themselves, so they don't really follow the same rules as non-item classes.  Basically, how the item class is approached depends on the item class itself, you can't just group them together.  Some may be more physical based, some more magical based, and some are just plain out there.