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Author Topic: Saturos Attacks  (Read 546 times)
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« on: August 22, 2017, 06:30:12 AM »

Hey, just wondering how the game determines where Saturos starts in his pattern?

I tried comparing it to the stuff we did for Star Magician (http://forum.goldensunhacking.net/index.php?topic=2784.msg46723#msg46723) and it didn't seem to be following this formula.
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« Reply #1 on: August 22, 2017, 04:54:22 PM »

For that, Guardian Ball used the first attack pattern. Saturos doesn't.

Mercury Lighthouse Saturos = One of the sequential patterns. (Starts on a random one, then increments.)
Venus Lighthouse Saturos = second attack pattern

Looks like Saturos is the second pattern.

0 = 0x00000000 = 0, , , 0
1 = 0x00003039 = 1, , , 0
2 = 0xD3DC167E = 0, , , 6
3 = 0xA70427DF = 1, , , 7
4 = 0xD6651C2C = 0, , , 4
5 = 0x0DAA96F5 = 4, , , 6
6 = 0xC21F1C8A = 0, , , 4
7 = 0x3EAD62FB = 3, , , 2
8 = 0xCD1DCF18 = 6, , , 7
9 = 0xAF5AAD71 = 5, , , 5
10 = 0x20DA7756 = 3, , , 7
11 = 0xAFE533D7 = 1, , , 3
12 = 0x69ACC4C4 = 6, , , 4
13 = 0x961BAFAD = 5, , , 7
14 = 0x261EB2E2 = 5, , , 2
15 = 0x525F3673 = 1, , , 6
16 = 0x65136930 = 3, , , 1
17 = 0x7E7099A9 = 4, , , 1
18 = 0xE6791B2E = 0, , , 3


Tried to put in the numbers for each Attack Pattern. (1, 2, 3, Sequential) ... But I still need to fill in 2 and 3. ; Sequential is basically random&7... if you ignore the bytes on the ends.)
The other sequential pattern starts on the first ability, so it is left out.


« Last Edit: August 22, 2017, 04:55:57 PM by Fox » Logged

Golden Sun Docs: Broken Seal - The Lost Age - Dark Dawn | Mario Sports Docs: Mario Golf & Mario Tennis | Misc. Docs
Refer to Yoshi's Lighthouse for any M&L hacking needs...
Did you know? In English, you are suppose to capitalize the languages. (e.g. English is a proper noun.) Subjects like math, science, history can be left lower-cased unless they are a title. (Kind of like how you can say either "my mom" or "Mom" in "I went with (X) to the store.", except that I don't think languages are ever lower-cased in English.) In Spanish, both subjects and languages are left lower-cased. (I put this here because I've noticed people make this mistake quite often. And am curious if they know about this, and whether they use their way because they believe this grammar usage should have never been a thing?

Remember kids! In getting a job, it's not about what you know, it's about WHO you know! So start making friends with the people that work where you want to work. :) (Friend of a friend and volunteering count too, so keep that in mind.)[/si
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« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2017, 03:33:42 AM »

Sorry I should have been more precise, I mean Saturos at the top of Mercury Lighthouse i.e. when his attacks are sequential.

The intent of this would be to input an arbitrary BRN seed and know where in the pattern Saturos is going to start (so that Eruption can be avoided)
« Last Edit: August 23, 2017, 03:35:49 AM by Plexa » Logged
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« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2017, 01:11:27 PM »

^The Mercury one would have beenn my first guess due to no mention of Menardi. But thanks for being precise!

--
So... assuming you could control the seed with reasonable time... I'm guessing getting it on the 8th/last one would be best case circumstance? (Or does it simply not matter once you know when Eruption will happen?)
You kind-of have to see two of his moves happen to figure out where he is in his pattern. (e.g. Avoid 5 and 6)

Saturos: (For reference so no one has to refer to the Editor.)
0=Heatflash
1=Fireball
2=Attack
3=Fireball
4=Heatflash
5=Attack
6=Eruption
7=Attack
« Last Edit: August 23, 2017, 01:30:42 PM by Fox » Logged

Golden Sun Docs: Broken Seal - The Lost Age - Dark Dawn | Mario Sports Docs: Mario Golf & Mario Tennis | Misc. Docs
Refer to Yoshi's Lighthouse for any M&L hacking needs...
Did you know? In English, you are suppose to capitalize the languages. (e.g. English is a proper noun.) Subjects like math, science, history can be left lower-cased unless they are a title. (Kind of like how you can say either "my mom" or "Mom" in "I went with (X) to the store.", except that I don't think languages are ever lower-cased in English.) In Spanish, both subjects and languages are left lower-cased. (I put this here because I've noticed people make this mistake quite often. And am curious if they know about this, and whether they use their way because they believe this grammar usage should have never been a thing?

Remember kids! In getting a job, it's not about what you know, it's about WHO you know! So start making friends with the people that work where you want to work. :) (Friend of a friend and volunteering count too, so keep that in mind.)[/si
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« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2017, 03:38:45 PM »

Yeah we already aim for that part of the cycle in all the S&Q categories, this was for the no S&Q category, meaning they have no control over where the BRN is at saturos. I've attached the project that inspired the question to this post. Someone doing no S&Q can simply input the commands issued into the sheet and the sheet will calculate the BRN advances for them. Thus allowing them to predict saturos's attack (and most importantly, avoid eruption)

I worked out from your earlier post that I just needed to bit.and with 0xFFF then bit.rshift by 8 places to isolate the number determining Saturos's attack.

* BRN Calc.xlsm (36.46 KB - downloaded 16 times.)
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« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2017, 04:50:29 PM »

Okay, cool... I had a feeling it might be something like that... from your previous post...  I guess now we know for sure! :)

0xFFF? or 0x7FF? ; I think it's better to do the rshift first and .and with 7, if you want it to look prettier, though. (As for me, I'd do it that way simple because the game does, kinda. The rng function called already does the shifting, so it is just an and instruction.)


Mercury Lighthouse is pretty early in the game... ~1-2 hours? So it would be cool if it could be manipulated consistently until that point, but I have doubts. (It helps to have two different random number generators, huh?)
Thought:  It would be interesting to know the minimum number of generated seeds possible through the entire game, though. (Kinda like a speed-run, but instead of managing time, manage the seeds. :P ; Going to guess GRN would have way more than BRN.)

-Some battles during the Vale prologue. (+Saturos+Menardi battle)
-Some battles in Sol Sanctum until Jenna has a certain amount of exp.
-Battles on the World Map.
-Bandits battle in Vault.
-More World Map battles.
-Cave...
-...


P.S. Not sure if that .xlsm would be better in Google Spreadsheets or not....?
« Last Edit: August 23, 2017, 05:31:28 PM by Fox » Logged

Golden Sun Docs: Broken Seal - The Lost Age - Dark Dawn | Mario Sports Docs: Mario Golf & Mario Tennis | Misc. Docs
Refer to Yoshi's Lighthouse for any M&L hacking needs...
Did you know? In English, you are suppose to capitalize the languages. (e.g. English is a proper noun.) Subjects like math, science, history can be left lower-cased unless they are a title. (Kind of like how you can say either "my mom" or "Mom" in "I went with (X) to the store.", except that I don't think languages are ever lower-cased in English.) In Spanish, both subjects and languages are left lower-cased. (I put this here because I've noticed people make this mistake quite often. And am curious if they know about this, and whether they use their way because they believe this grammar usage should have never been a thing?

Remember kids! In getting a job, it's not about what you know, it's about WHO you know! So start making friends with the people that work where you want to work. :) (Friend of a friend and volunteering count too, so keep that in mind.)[/si
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« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2017, 12:50:20 AM »

Google sheet may have been better, but I had to write some VBA functions for RNG advance and whatnot. It's not feasible to track BRNs to manipulate fights, but since Saturos is so dangerous and Eruption is just instant gg counting BRNs to that point is feasible with a useful application.
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« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2017, 02:27:33 AM »

Alright cool.

Going to need to see if I can view the scripts in any free software... er.... Edit:  OpenOffice appears to view them. - Seems to start most lines with "Rem", though... which looks weird.
Code:
Rem Attribute VBA_ModuleType=VBAModule
Sub Module2
Rem Public Function RNA(x As Double) As Double
Rem     g = x
Rem     m = 20077
Rem     n = 16838
Rem     g1 = g * m
Rem     g2 = g * n
Rem     g2 = Application.WorksheetFunction.Bitand(g2, Application.WorksheetFunction.Hex2Dec("FFFF"))
Rem     g = g1 + g2 * Application.WorksheetFunction.Hex2Dec("10000")
Rem     g = Application.WorksheetFunction.Bitand(g, Application.WorksheetFunction.Hex2Dec("FFFFFFFF"))
Rem     c = Application.WorksheetFunction.Hex2Dec("3039")
Rem     g = g + c
Rem     g = Application.WorksheetFunction.Bitand(g, Application.WorksheetFunction.Hex2Dec("FFFFFFFF"))
Rem
Rem RNA = g
Rem
Rem End Function
End Sub

I think Google Spreadsheets also had some script editor, but I never really bothered using it yet... so....

So Mercury Lighthouse Saturos is the only enemy that actually matters for BRNs?

---
Interesting you are using "doubles"... I think "integers" are the way to go, but anyway... There may be a possibility that this code can be shortened and made readable at the same time?


Not sure how different Spreadsheet VB is from VB.NET ... But I will want to try &H for hex and &(or and?) for and.... ; 0x3039 is actually just 12345.... ; Also, I assume "Application.WorksheetFunction" can be set to a variable, and used from there. variable.Hex2Dec(whatever.....)


--
Edit again:  Pwn'd... ~20 minutes before I noticed next post. :D
« Last Edit: August 24, 2017, 03:40:08 AM by Fox » Logged

Golden Sun Docs: Broken Seal - The Lost Age - Dark Dawn | Mario Sports Docs: Mario Golf & Mario Tennis | Misc. Docs
Refer to Yoshi's Lighthouse for any M&L hacking needs...
Did you know? In English, you are suppose to capitalize the languages. (e.g. English is a proper noun.) Subjects like math, science, history can be left lower-cased unless they are a title. (Kind of like how you can say either "my mom" or "Mom" in "I went with (X) to the store.", except that I don't think languages are ever lower-cased in English.) In Spanish, both subjects and languages are left lower-cased. (I put this here because I've noticed people make this mistake quite often. And am curious if they know about this, and whether they use their way because they believe this grammar usage should have never been a thing?

Remember kids! In getting a job, it's not about what you know, it's about WHO you know! So start making friends with the people that work where you want to work. :) (Friend of a friend and volunteering count too, so keep that in mind.)[/si
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« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2017, 03:06:48 AM »

Manticore and Kraken would probably be the other two. Kraken is more difficult because his attack will depend on what the elven shirt user does, and beyond the first attack there's not much you can do to manip beyond that (or atleast I can't think of a way). Manticore is also a pattern boss like saturos but not nearly as scary since you won't get OTKO by the manticore on any of his turns.
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Today at 05:19:46 AM
Majora: Perfect. Thank you!
Today at 04:45:37 AM
Atrius: Also, you can put use [nobbc][/nobbc] to show bbcode without it being parsed.
Today at 04:22:03 AM
Atrius: The bbcode wasn't designed to handle "https://youtu.be/" links.  It should be fixed now.
Today at 01:06:01 AM
Majora: Read that sometimes SMF doesn't like YouTube's https links, seems to have the same issue with http as well
Today at 01:04:59 AM
Majora: Sorry lol, didn't realize it would embed the player into the chat. At least that works! tl;dr: embedded YouTube videos fail to appear in forum posts
Today at 01:04:07 AM
Majora: Just noticed this, not sure if it's already been mentioned but it looks like the forum is breaking embedded YouTube links in posts using BBCode [youtube][/youtube] tags
December 13, 2017, 09:19:38 PM
Fox: Okay, so that Summon Night games adds the fram number to the seed, before generating another seed via mul/add....  (GS1-GS3 never adds the fram number.) ... So um, that makes sense! ;  Summon Night:  ((seed + frame) * 0x343FD + 0x269E3C) >> 0x10 ; Which is also on the list here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_congruential_generator
December 12, 2017, 11:10:45 PM
Fox: Yes, and there could be contests. Maybe ones where 1st/2nd/3rd place get a cash reward, but eh. Dunno.... Kind of thinking about making a topic about how people got their job, and what was their experience. (e.g. Did they use references of people already working in the job, and various other things.)
December 09, 2017, 04:24:14 AM
Majora: Import old forum posts for reference, perhaps take posts containing important info like documentation away from the old stickied forum post model and make them into their own pages on a site with an in-built search bar. Might help with SEO, too. If nothing else, perhaps whipping them into PDFs and hosting them via Scribd? The possibilities are boundless when it comes to restructuring a site
December 09, 2017, 04:20:02 AM
Majora: Just a nice idea to have even if it doesn't come to fruition. Updating, modernizing, always a good idea. Could probably do something pretty nifty using a good Wordpress theme
December 09, 2017, 04:15:45 AM
Majora: Would be kind of neat to do something like that for GSHC. Could change it up a bit to show all tweets/instagram posts/facebook posts/golden sun subreddit posts all in one sidebar. It would be cool in that it gives the site it's on (and the topic in general) appear more lively and active, which is a plus
December 09, 2017, 04:14:19 AM
Majora: That does sound interesting. One cool thing I've seen some sites use is a sort of unique take on a sidebar option that acts like a social media integration (like, "See GSHC's latest Tweets"). It displays activity from a variety of related sites, such as Reddit, Twitter, Instagram, etc.
December 09, 2017, 12:58:53 AM
Fox: And the way it'd work via code is not that all users would instantly get nicknames the minute you register... but rather, the moment you view a name if it doesn't have a nickname, it gets one. (My Thoughts.)
December 09, 2017, 12:53:55 AM
Fox: (I was thinking that it would be "Name (Nickname)" ... The nickname is what you first known the user as, and you can change that yourself... and the Name is what the user wants to be called... Something like that.
December 09, 2017, 12:47:56 AM
Fox: So like... for starters, one idea I had was to make it so anyone can name anyone... much like how it works on Skype, and you (the namer) would be the only one to see it, and such...
December 09, 2017, 12:45:02 AM
Fox: Would need to be carefully thought out and tested, though.
December 09, 2017, 12:43:02 AM
Fox: I'm thinking I could make it so that name changes can happen whenever... (Without any limit)... Since I believe there's a way to do it with minimum confusion. (I think.) Hmm....
December 09, 2017, 12:31:36 AM
Fox: (I mean an offline version... at least initially.)
December 09, 2017, 12:25:01 AM
Fox: Now that I have thought about it a bit more, would I be right to assume that GSHC would be one of the most interesting websites to administrate, or no? It's sad to see not much going on with it. == I almost want to make a concept website at some point. :D Anyway, how is everyone doing today?
December 06, 2017, 12:12:59 AM
Fox: Like... Start using Github or something... Do like how many of those other projects such as Citra (WIP 3DS Emulator) does. Etc.

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