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Golden Signatures - Of Adepts and Genetics

Started by Rolina, 20, January, 2013, 09:24:53 PM

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Rolina

I'm aware that this stuff is a bit more technical and in-depth than my other supplemental materials, and has much less weight on the signatures themselves, but they can come in handy when creating your character.  These will come in parts as I work on them, and unlike the others aren't in specifically sorted sets.


Part 1:  An Adept's Race
There are three known races for adepts - Human, Beastling, and Drake.  Each of these races, while very similar to one another, have a few differences apart from the obvious outwards appearance that help them to stand apart from one another.


Humans
Humans are the most populous of the three races, although their lead in terms of population is starting to even out with the other two as time goes on.  Humans are usually about 5-6 ft. tall, and weigh about 100-200 lb., with a slight bias towards lesser weights. They have varying skin colors, from pale and tan to ebony in color, which is largely influenced by regional descent.  Hair color mostly depends on their element, though it is known to fade to a grey or white with age.  Their skin tends to be softer than other races, and as a result the elements have a greater influence on humans than other races.

Humans have the ability to channel energy from objects much more efficiently than Drakes or Beastlings thanks to the relative softness of their skin.  Because of this, they are able to achieve powerful states of being by channeling power from various tools.  This is a technique called "Overburst", and is exclusive to the human race.  However, prolonged exposure to these energies can be lethal, and as a result djinn are used to channel away excess power so as to prevent death upon using overburst.

The environment has a very strong affect on humans as well - human beings are more susceptible to location-influence at birth, and as a result far more humans are born with an elemental affinity influenced by location rather than bloodline.

A notable sub-race of Human is the Dwarf race.  While smaller and stockier in stature, they share all of the same traits as humans in regards to their ability to channel alchemy and their dominant/recessive relationship to other races.

Examples of Humans in canon include:  Isaac, Mia, Eoleo

Overdrive Class:  Overburst (Item Dependent)
Weak Influence:  35% chance of location override
Moderate Influence:  65% chance of location override
Strong Influence:  85% chance of location override
Global Population: 45% of Weyard


Beastling
Beastlings are the second-most populous of races.  They typically range from 4-7 ft. tall, and weigh between 100-300 lb., though trend towards the middle.  Their skin color largely matches their hair color, and as a result is more elementally influenced than racial influenced.  However, while skin and hair color are more vivid in their youth, with age the color will begin to become pale or fade until it is nearly grey-white in color.  Their skin is a bit more rugged than other races, and as such they are able to endure much more rugged terrain than other races.

Beastlings are born with the ability to transform from their hominid appearance to a more feral, anthropomorphic beast-like form.  The specific form is different for various families, but there are three main types - lupine, vulpine, and feline.  While there are other varieties, these three are the most common.  All varieties are mammalian in nature.  With this "Beastform" ability, beastlings can become much more powerful.  However, when unleashing this feral form, the longer they are in it, the easier it is for them to become feral themselves, and thus be incapable of transforming back on their own.  To ease in this process, djinn are typically used to help maintain the transformation safely, and beastlings will quickly revert back once the energy of said djinn is spent.

The beastling's rugged skin allows them to thrive in terrain unsuited to other races, and as a result they are far more common in mountainous terrain, as well as lands with harsher climates.  While they are by no means exclusive to these regions, they are able to adapt to them far better than other races.

Examples of Beastlings in canon include:  Maha, Sveta, Vande

Overdrive Class:  Beastform (Innate, bloodline dependent)
Weak Influence:  25% chance of location override
Moderate Influence:  50% chance of location override
Strong Influence:  70% chance of location override
Global Population: 30% of Weyard


Drakes
Drakes are the least populous race, though their numbers are on the rise.  They typically range from 4-6 ft. tall, and weigh between 150-250 lb.  Notably, males tend to be towards the mid-to-heavy end of the scale, while females range from light-to-mid.  Their skin color tends to range from greens, blues, and reds, though is usually a pale shade of it.  Their skin also has scales, usually in a deeper shade of their skin color.  These scales do not cover most of their body, but still remain their most defining trait.  Their hair colors tend to be less vivid than other races, but holds color far better with age, not fading much at all when elderly.

Drakes have the ability to transform into a dragon.  As a dragon, they are able to take advantage of all of the abilities of their form, including the elemental breath and sometimes flight associated with it.  The specific type of dragon they transform into primarily depends on the elemental affinity of the Drake themselves, as well as the aspect they're more familiar with - Mercury drakes will transform into an aquatic dragon or one suited for frozen tundras, while a Venusian drakes may transform into a forest or mountain dragon.  In terms of size, the dragons that drakes can transform into are about as tall as they are in their usual hominid form.  The act of transforming used to spend all of a drake's life energy, essentially being lethal to them.  However, they've learned to use djinn to channel energy into them, allowing for safe transformations.

The scaled skin of a drake allows them to live in more extreme climates than other races.  While other races are most comfortable in more temperate climates, Drakes have no problems with extreme heat and cold, and can live somewhat comfortably in both frozen tundras and deserts, provided that they can find plenty of food and resources.  Furthermore, the scaled skin makes them more resilient to the effects of locations strong in an elemental energy, causing them to retain element through bloodline at a much higher rate when exposed to such locations.

Examples of Drakes in canon include:  Karst, Puelle, Saturos

Overdrive Class:  Dragonform (Innate, element dependent)
Weak Influence:  20% chance of location override
Moderate Influence:  30% chance of location override
Strong Influence:  50% chance of location override
Global Population: 25% of Weyard


Genetics and Mixed-race children
When two members of different races get together, they can actually have children.  However, the children are not of mixed race, but rather are of one race or another.  Specifically, inter-racial unions have a particular cycle of dominant and recessive natures.

The Human Race is recessive to The Beastling Race
The Beastling Race is recessive to The Drake Race
The Drake Race is recessive to The Human Race


As such, when a human and beastling get together, on average a child has a 75% chance that they will be a beastling, while they have about a 25% chance of being a human.  Similar rates apply to other races.

When the Dwarf Subrace is involved, it is treated like human for the most part.  Human and Dwarf have a 50/50 split in terms of children with one another, and when involved with other races, any children that would be human will be a dwarf in the event of a dwarven parent.

Rolina

#1
Part 2:  Environmental Effects on Genetics
It's well known that elemental alignment runs in families, but many are surprised when a child is born with an elemental alignment matching neither parent.  This is called Environmental Shift, and is a phenomena unique to certain parts of Weyard.

What is Environmental Shift?
Environmental Shift is defined as the tendency of environmental forces to alter, modify, or otherwise change the aspect of a person.  There are two main types of Environmental Shift - Elemental Override, and Psynergetic Retention.  These phenomena happen near locations with a powerful alchemical presence.  Such locations are identified by their above average presence of Psynergy Stones - a type of crystallized alchemy essence - often in large sizes as well.  People living near these locations are affected by Elemental Shift, and are affected gradually over many generations.  Occasionally events can occur which trigger an effect called Spontaneous Environmental Shift, though instances of such events are unheard of outside of Lost Ages.  Spontaneous events occur when exposure to alchemical energies bring about new abilities within a person, but during Golden Ages such exposure is global, and as a result spontaneous shifts do not occur.

What is Elemental Override?
Elemental Override is the tendency for environmental factors to influence the elemental affinity of a developing lifeform.  It doesn't matter what type of lifeform it is, from the moment of conception to birth/hatching, exposure of the developing lifeform to an environment with a strong elemental presence can actually cause them to change their element.  Because of this, it is possible for a Mercury Adept to be born to a couple of Mars Adept parents.  Ordinarily, elemental affinity is purely genetic - a 50/50 chance for the child to be the element of either parent.  However, when exposed to the alchemical energies of an elementally charged area, the child may instead change to the element of the area instead.

The likelihood of this happening to a chlid depends on two factors - the strength of the area, and the race ofthe child.  The following chart can be used as a quick reference guide:


Listed here are statistics of children born within three types of areas - an area with a weak elemental influence, an area with a moderate elemental influence, and an area with a strong elemental influence.  While actual zones of influence are not quite as concrete as these three values, it does help to illustrate the example.  So what generates these fields?  Well, there's actually three types of fields...

  • Type 1 areas only generate a weak elemental influence, and the distance is somewhat small compared to other areas.
  • Type 2 areas generate a moderate elemental influence around them, and extend weak influence to a distance.  Examples of this type of area include Air's Rock and Mt. Mikage.
  • Type 3 areas generate a strong elemental influence nearby, when gradually shifts down to a weak influence over a wide area.  This type of field is unique to the Elemental Lighthouses, and is the largest type of field.

Overall, Elemental Override is one of the most notable affects of alchemy upon the people, overpowering even the strongest of bloodlines.  It is to be noted, though, that not every area with powerful alchemical energy causes Elemental Override - only those which a strong presence of a single element cause it.  Other areas, such as Mt. Aleph and the legendary city of Vale, have a powerful alchemical presence, but no single elemental affinity.  As a result, children born in such places have their elemental affinities determined entirely by bloodline alone.

What is Psynergetic Retention?
When the power of alchemy leaves Weyard, the alchemical energy which grants people the powers of psynergy and their identity as Adepts fades away.  Over time, most people become Inepts, or those who are incapable of casting psynergy.  However, near places with a strong alchemical presence, the people within the field of influence are able to pass down their powers as adepts for many more generations.  This is what is called "Psynergetic Retention", and the psynergy stones present at such places are largely responsible for these effects.  

Of course, eventually this power too can wane, and over time the crystals will lose their power, and thus the people lose their ability to use psynergy.

Fundaments and Environments
While the environment most definitely has an affect on one's elemental affinity, there is no correlation between the environment and one's Fundamental affinity.  It is currently unknown what determines one's fundamental affinity, as it is not passed on through bloodline, race, nor environment, but rather is as unique as the individuals themselves.  There are some theories, though - one theory suggests that it is the soul of an adept that determines their fundamental affinity, while others suggest things like upbringing or personality.  One thing is certain, though - environment has absolutely no affect on it.  Even when exposed to the pure elemental energy of the lighthouses, the resulting child is able to cast any number of aspects of such elements in any number of ways.

Rolina

#2
Part 3:  Magnitude of Power and Non-Adpets
In this day and age, almost everyone is an adept to some degree.  However, not all adepts are equal - while some are capable of learning the greatest of spells, others are only able to gain a mastery over utilities and basics.  On top of that you have the Inepts - people with only enough alchemical power to see psynergy, but not enough to cast even the most basic of basic spells.  While genetics does play a role in the power of an adept, it is only one of many factors, and isn't the primary one at that.  Still, an overview of the range in power of adepts is important to cover.  Player Characters are universally considered to be S-rank, so most of this post is for the sake of worldbuilding.

Classifications of Power
For the convenience of the reader, gaming terms will be used in this section for the sake of familiarity and comparison.  If we were to give a letter grade to each adept strength, this is what types of spells they could learn:

Rank S:  Can learn at any level
Rank A:  Can only learn spells below level 50
Rank B:  Can only learn spells below level 40
Rank C:  Can only learn spells below level 30
Rank D:  Can only learn spells below level 20
Rank E:  Can only learn spells below level 10
Rank F:  Inept.  Cannot learn psynergy.


It should be noted that all PCs, unless they elect otherwise, are to be considered Rank S.  This means that nobody in the forums has a cutoff level for learning spells, period.

Rank S (Master Adept)
Among the most powerful of spellcasters are Rank S adepts, classified as "Master Adepts".  These are adepts who can learn a spell at any level, regardless of what it may be.  Of course, spells are very rarely learned above level 50, with the spell learned the latest being around 56-58.  As such, while they are impressive, they're not too terribly stronger than a Rank A adept, and are prized at about equal in value to an army.  Adepts of this rank are most commonly Mages, though the rare rank S adept may choose to be a physical fighter instead.  About 9% of the world's population are of Rank S.

Rank A (Grand Adept)
Generally considered elite in terms of power, Rank A adepts can learn all but the most powerful of spells, classified as "Grand Adepts."  These are adepts whom, in the games, would be able to learn any spell up until they hit level 50.  After that, they simply cannot draw enough power to pull off anything stronger.  This does not mean that they are incapable of learning spell lines like the Gaia line, but it does mean that they cannot learn the top tier of that line, Grand Gaia, as it would have been learned at level 54.  Had Isaac been a Rank A adept, he'd have stopped learning spells at Stone Spire.  Rank A adepts are as often mages as they are warriors, and are often sought out my military forces for their power.  About 11% of the world's population are Rank A.

Rank B (Strong Adept)
Among the stronger of adepts are the Rank B adepts, who can learn spells up to level 40, classified as "Strong Adepts."  These are adepts who are still capable of learning strong spells, but not quite strong enough to be sought after by militaries.  Still, many a Rank B adept make a powerful warrior, and others often are called upon to protect towns from monsters.  Still, others can be seen acting as mercenaries.  About 13% of the world's population are Rank B.

Rank C (Able Adept)
About average in power, Rank C adepts are generally non-combatant in nature, classified as "Able Adepts."  They are unable to learn spells above level 30 in power.  Rank C adepts generally don't spend time fighting, but rather use their spells to do things like run local clinics or perhaps entertain.  Enough power to make a living using it, but not enough to really make a difference in battle when it counts.  About 15% of the world's population are Rank C.

Rank D (Fair Adept)
A weaker variety of adept, rank D adepts stay out of combat whenever possible, classified as "Fair Adepts."  Rank D adepts are incapable of learning spells after level 20.  At this strength, they are able to use psynergy to assist them in their jobs and daily routines, but it isn't strong enough to make a livelihood off of the strength of their spells alone.  To them, psynergy becomes much more of a tool to help them in their lives.  About 15% of the world's population are Rank D.

Rank E (Basic Adept)
The weakest variety of adept, Rank E adepts know only the basics, which has earned them the classification of "Basic Adepts."  Rank E adepts can only learn spells up to level 10, and as such only use spells for the most basic of needs, typically only using them for things such as chores or medial labor.  As they are incapable of casting even moderately powerful spells, they tend to take jobs that don't really require much psynergy, and live their life in a way that they are not dependent upon it.  About 17% of the world's population are Rank E Adepts.

Rank F (Non-adept)
At Rank F, a person can no longer be considered an adept, and is classified as an Non-Adept instead.  This classification is a general term meant to describe those who cannot wield any form of psynergy, though sometimes they are called "Inepts" as a form of slander.  However, their non-adept nature does not mean they cannot see psynergy - in the Golden Age, they receive enough Alchemical power from Weyard itself that they can perceive psynergy just as well as any adept.  However, they must live their lives completely without psynergy at all.  In the ancient past, these people were the Exathi and Fori, but in modern times they're just referred to as Non-Adepts.  Those whom can keep up with Adepts in combat are sometimes referred to as "Freelancers".  About 20% of the world's population are Non-Adepts.

Of Ranks, Classes, and Djinn
Of note is the effects of djinn on adepts of differing ranks - that is to say, they are all affected in the same manner.  By having djinn set to the adept, they can grow stronger, or even be just plain different in nature, such as an ordinarily slow person being able to move quickly with the right combination of set djinn.  All adepts are also able to draw upon the power of djinn, as well as summon spirits with them.  Inepts, while unable to draw out the power of djinn or summon, are still affected by having set djinn, and thus are able to take full advantage of the strength changing powers of djinn.

Thunder-squall

Quote from: Rolina on 20, January, 2013, 09:24:53 PM

Genetics and Mixed-race children
When two members of different races get together, they can actually have children.  However, the children are not of mixed race, but rather are of one race or another.  Specifically, inter-racial unions have a particular cycle of dominant and recessive natures.

The Human Race is recessive to The Beastling Race
The Beastling Race is recessive to The Drake Race
The Drake Race is recessive to The Human Race


As such, when a human and beastling get together, on average a child has a 75% chance that they will be a beastling, while they have about a 25% chance of being a human.  Similar rates apply to other races.

When the Dwarf Subrace is involved, it is treated like human for the most part.  Human and Dwarf have a 50/50 split in terms of children with one another, and when involved with other races, any children that would be human will be a dwarf in the event of a dwarven parent.

Woah, that's an epic amount of work.  It'll take me some time to digest, but I noticed that the "recessive" traits here don't function as they do in normal genetics, where dominance/recessiveness isn't cyclical.  But this is fiction, so you can do what you want.  What was the design philosophy behind making this hereditary stuff cyclical?

Rolina

Because I hate figuring out the mechanics of half-breeds.  No, seriously.  Figuring out how the hell "Half X half Y" works and is neither mary sue or broken as hell or utterly worthless is just... ick.  It's why I reskin Half-Elves in D&D as just another kind of Elf.


Also, soon to be here:  Hair.  Expect work on this Sunday-ish.

Luna_blade

I just finished reading. This is a real nice piece of work.
I have some questions about it:

  • Where is the Jovian empire? Anemos maybe?
  • You're refering to Howl's and weapon unleashes with overburst right?
  • 85% of the total population is adept? I guess the is post-GS right?
How about the Water race? We know that Poseidon can use Psynergy. There are also the Hydros statues...

Well anyway this gives me alot of inspiration for my own Race/Psynergy theories. Yours are also way more cannon than mine. (I basically changed the humans the the neutral race and Golems as Earth)
"Hear the sounds and melodies
Of rilets flowing down
They're the verlasting songs
Whispering all the time
As a warning that behind some rocks
There's a rigid grap even
Oreads fear the tread"

FrozenWrath

The Hydros Statues are objects given sentience, Lunablade, kinda like golems. Poseidon is likened more to a monster, and not actually a human or human-like being.

Rolina

Jovian Empire, later renamed Aeolean Empire, is based in GSAR.  This whole thread was copy-pasted from there back when I was hanging out there, so it's a relic of that.  It was an RP forum then, and that was one of the factions.

Also, races are not in any way tied to element in this system.

Luna_blade

Quote from: ScarletFlames on 04, July, 2014, 04:44:28 PM
The Hydros Statues are objects given sentience, Lunablade, kinda like golems. Poseidon is likened more to a monster, and not actually a human or human-like being.
Uhh yeah. I guess that's true.

Well mermaids or some human+fish creature may exist in weyard, but we just didn't see them in the game.
I just think it is weird that all the elemental races (the four walls in Mars Lighthouse) are not in harmony, even in DD...

Poseidon was just guarding that spot wasn't he? Awakened by the tidal wave? Just because he attacks the player, who is even indirectly responible for waking him, does only make him an enemy. With unfortunatly little backstory.

Quote from: Rolina
Jovian Empire, later renamed Aeolean Empire, is based in GSAR.  This whole thread was copy-pasted from there back when I was hanging out there, so it's a relic of that.  It was an RP forum then, and that was one of the factions.

Also, races are not in any way tied to element in this system.
Okay.
"Hear the sounds and melodies
Of rilets flowing down
They're the verlasting songs
Whispering all the time
As a warning that behind some rocks
There's a rigid grap even
Oreads fear the tread"

FrozenWrath

Quote from: Luna_blade on 05, July, 2014, 04:17:36 AMPoseidon was just guarding that spot wasn't he? Awakened by the tidal wave? Just because he attacks the player, who is even indirectly responible for waking him, does only make him an enemy. With unfortunatly little backstory.
http://goldensunwiki.net/Poseidon
ಠ_ಠ :Sweat:

Rolina

Part 4:  Of Elemental Influence and Hair
An interesting thing about the world of Weyard is that even something as simple as the color of one's hair is influenced by the elements.  However, that does not mean that one's family plays no role in said hair color, or that having one element means you have the same color or shade as another.  In general, it can be said that there are three primary types of hair color - Type A, Type B, and Type C.  It is this type that is passed down in a hereditary fashion.

Hair of the Venus Element

The Venus element tends to have earthy hues, fitting of its element.  Type A colors range in browns, tans, and maroons.  Type B colors tend to be blondes, such as auburn, golden, and dirty blondes.  Type C colors tend to be darker greens, such as forest greens and olives.

Hair of the Mars Element

The Mars element tends to have brighter, more vivid colors.  Type A colors tend to be reds, ranging from rose to orange to even some slight brown hues.  Type B colors tend to be lighter purples, such as pinks and fuchsias.  Type C colors tend to be lighter blues, ranging from ceruleans to even cyans.

Hair of the Jupiter Element

The Jupiter element tends bright, vibrant colors.  Type A colors tend to be deeper purples, ranging from royal purples to magentas.  Type B colors tend to be mid-ranged blondes, ranging from goldenrods to light blondes and lighter shades of dirty blonde.  Type C colors tend to be vibrant greens, including shades like limes and emeralds.

Hair of the Mercury Element

The Mercury element tends to lean towards more marine shades, fitting for its nature.  Type A colors tend to be darker blues, ranging from deep navy to darker shades of cerulean.  Type B colors tend to be light blondes, ranging from some more "platinum" blondes to more sandy colors.  Type C colors tend to be greens with a more marine tint to them, such as seafoam and teal.


Hair Types and Genetics
Hair types, much like with races, has a cyclical genetic nature.  This nature also applies regardless of the race of the parents, and is one of the few traits between the races that is similar enough to pass down in this manner.  As a general rule:

A is dominant to B
B is dominant to C
C is dominant to A

Hair thickness, natural shape, and similar properties have no influence from the elements.  Being martian has no impact on whether your hair is thick and curly or long and straight - this matter is strictly genetic, and much more complex than colors.  Furthermore, unlike hair colors, interracial parents don't necessarily have predicable results for the child.  Much is still unknown about how the specifics on such things work.

Luna_blade

Quote from: ScarletFlames on 05, July, 2014, 08:23:46 PM
Quote from: Luna_blade on 05, July, 2014, 04:17:36 AMPoseidon was just guarding that spot wasn't he? Awakened by the tidal wave? Just because he attacks the player, who is even indirectly responible for waking him, does only make him an enemy. With unfortunatly little backstory.
http://goldensunwiki.net/Poseidon
ಠ_ಠ :Sweat:
...Okay. Yeah, I should have looked more on the wiki.
...What are you staring at, googly eyes?

So yeah, I guess it's time to head back to the drawing table with my 'Mercury' Race...
Perhaps not.

@Rolina: If there dominance when it comes to the parents, how come Ivan and his sister have different hair colours? Or is the colour mostly defined by the type of the Adept itself? Or vice versa?

Is the Ivan thing solved when they have different parents? Yes I guess.
"Hear the sounds and melodies
Of rilets flowing down
They're the verlasting songs
Whispering all the time
As a warning that behind some rocks
There's a rigid grap even
Oreads fear the tread"

Daddy Poi's Oily Gorillas

#12
Oh, that's nice...

So is hair somehow connected to the Fundaments as well?

I notice that the Type B's often look lighter, and the Type C's look darker... at least that's what I thought at one glance, could be wrong, though.


@Luna: If I had to guess... since Role said it was a general rule... it /probably/ means that those hair colors are more likely, but not definite? Which means someone could have been lucky. <3
Golden Sun Docs: Broken Seal - The Lost Age - Dark Dawn | Mario Sports Docs: Mario Golf & Mario Tennis | Misc. Docs
Refer to Yoshi's Lighthouse for any M&L hacking needs...

Sometimes I like to compare apples to oranges. (Figuratively) ... They are both fruits, but which one would you eat more? (If taken literally, I'd probably choose apples.)
Maybe it is over-analyzing, but it doesn't mean the information is useless.


The only GS Discord servers with significance are:
Golden Sun Hacking Community
GS Speedrunning
/r/Golden Sun
GS United Nations
Temple of Kraden

Can you believe how small the Golden Sun Community is?

2+2=5 Don't believe me? Those are rounded decimal numbers. Take that, flat earth theorists! :)

Rolina

#13
How Genetics Works:

Genes typically come in pairs, you have XX and XY for male and female, right?  When looking at the kid:

.    ,---------.
    |  X |  Y |
,----+----+----|
|  X | XX | XY |
|  X | XX | XY |
`--------------'


In this instance, there's a 50/50 chance for male and female.  Now then, let's look at how cyclical dominance work, k?

AA - Type A
AB - Type A
BB - Type B
BC - Type B
CC - Type C
CA - Type C

No matter what, the dominant letter is written first.  So, for Ivan's family, there's a few things that could have happened.  Let's look a some of them, shall we?

.    ,---------.
    |  A |  B |
,----+----+----|
|  B | AB | BB |
|  B | AB | BB |
`--------------'


In this example, Ivan and his sister have a 50/50 chance for Type A (Purple) or Type B (Blonde) hair.  Another Example:

.    ,---------.
    |  A |  B |
,----+----+----|
|  B | AB | BB |
|  C | CA | BC |
`--------------'


In this example, Ivan and his sister have a 25% chance of having Type A (Purple), a 50% chance of Type B (Blonde), and a 25% chance of Type C (Green).   Now, taking these into consideration, let's look at how Karis works.  Now, if Ivan had BB hair:

.    ,---------.
    |  B |  B |
,----+----+----|
|  C | BC | BC |
|  C | BC | BC |
`--------------'


Then no matter what, his kid would have Blonde hair as well.  This means that Ivan is not BB, but is probably BC.  So then, let's look at what his child could potentially be:

.    ,---------.
    |  B |  C |
,----+----+----|
|  C | BC | CC |
|  A | AB | CA |
`--------------'


In this example, Ivan's wife has Type C hair.  His kids have a 25% chance for Type B, a 50% chance of Type C, and a 25% chance for Type A.  As such, Ivan could potentially have kids with three different types of colors.  In all likelyhood though, considering the people who live in the area his wife most likely has blonde hair which would need to look like this:

.    ,---------.
    |  B |  C |
,----+----+----|
|  B | BB | BC |
|  C | BC | CC |
`--------------'


Here, there's a 75% chance of Type B hair, which means it's very likely that all his children could be blonde.  However, we know from the fact that Karis was born that there's Type C genes in there - thus, we see that as there must be some chance, Ivan must be BC, and if his wife is blonde so too much she, as that's the only way for the Type C hair to be possible (at 25% in this case).



@Fundaments and hair:  Fundaments have no effect on hair.  Purple Haired Jovians can use Wind, Lightning, or Celestial energy just fine.  In fact, Fundaments are not tied to genetics in any way - so you can have a Lightning Specialist get with a Plant Specialist and have the kid wind up shooting astral lasers at their foes via Celestial energy.  For creating characters and determining fundaments, I'd say just go with what feels right.  As for the trends, there are in fact some.

Type A reflects the element's signature color.
Type B tends to be Blondes
Type C tends to be Greens
Mars is the exception - Type Bs and Cs came from Jenna and Saturos respectively, thus the Reddish Purples and lighter Blues.  The only one with liberties taken was Venus, which has no canon Green Haired character, but come on, you know it'd be a good fit. ;)

As for why B is blones and C is greens... well, I kinda did that on purpose.  You can have a whole family who blonde, but the Father is Venusian, the Mother Mercurian, and the kid Jovian.  It actually helps to keep them looking the part of the family even with the "color coordinated for your convenience" nature of Golden Sun Hair Colors.

If you're curious as to the inspirations...

Venus - Type A based on Felix, Type B based on Isaac, Type C based on logic
Mars - Type A based on Garet and his 4-colored hair, Type B based on Jenna, Type C based on Saturos
Jupiter - Type A based on Hamma/Feizhi, Type B based on Ivan/Sheba, Type C based on Karis
Mercury - Type A based on Alex, Type B based on Justin/Meghan (Mia's apprentices in Imil), Type C inspired by Mia/Piers

Obviously, things aren't exact, and some liberties were taken to make things stand out a bit, particularly with Type C Mercury and Type C Venus.  But I think it works out well.

Daddy Poi's Oily Gorillas

#14
QuoteIn this instance, there's a 50/50 chance for male and female.  Now then, let's look at how cyclical dominance work, k?
Since genetic disorders like the Klinefelter syndrome (XXY) may sometimes be possible (Very rare, though.) It might not be exactly 50/50 chance, but then again, I don't remember anyone in Golden Sun having a genetic disorder. So yeah, it's probably 50/50 in Golden Sun.

Closest people I could imagine having gender disorders are Saturos and Menardi, since their faces look strange. But I bet that's more of a race thing than a gender thing.


And yay. I was right about there being some type of probability value for different hair colors.

QuoteFundaments are not tied to genetics in any way
Sounds good, I guess.
Golden Sun Docs: Broken Seal - The Lost Age - Dark Dawn | Mario Sports Docs: Mario Golf & Mario Tennis | Misc. Docs
Refer to Yoshi's Lighthouse for any M&L hacking needs...

Sometimes I like to compare apples to oranges. (Figuratively) ... They are both fruits, but which one would you eat more? (If taken literally, I'd probably choose apples.)
Maybe it is over-analyzing, but it doesn't mean the information is useless.


The only GS Discord servers with significance are:
Golden Sun Hacking Community
GS Speedrunning
/r/Golden Sun
GS United Nations
Temple of Kraden

Can you believe how small the Golden Sun Community is?

2+2=5 Don't believe me? Those are rounded decimal numbers. Take that, flat earth theorists! :)

Rolina

This is a simplified version of things, as it was taught to me in 6th grade.  Obviously, it'll be a ton more complicated when you get into it, but the point of this is to get the general gist across, not to go in depth with detail.  Also, a huge amount of this is to facilitate character creation.  In this case, genetics is a guideline to help you build the character's family.  By knowing where they were born, and how you build your character, you can use these guides to reverse engineer what your family is like.

Also, this guide helps to prevent people from jumping in and saying "Nuh uh, your character can't be like that because that's not how things work!"  Well, you can turn around and go "Actually, if you look at this from a genetic point of view, I can". 

Also also, another point that needs being made is that those color ranges aren't exact.  To really be accurate, I'd need to show a 3-dimensional range, but if I were to try that it'd be impossible to accurately portray the range.  As such, I made ranges that gave the best approximation based on four-point color gradients (Light, Shift1, Shift2, Dark).  If you have a shade that clearly would fit in one of them, but isn't quite displayed, it'll be fine.  Himi's a prime example of this, what with her black hair and all.  I'd say she's a Type A Venus, despite the fact that her hair color technically isn't on the scale.  Her parent's portraits help with theory too, but it's an easy argument for Himi to be that.

zman9000

Wuh...
what is the point of this topic? cause i think i missed it.

this seems like... i don't know... strange to say the least.

also kinda hard to follow... so yeah.

so whats the point of this again?
and can you make it easier to understand is all i ask.
Check my youtube channel out for lots of cool gaming related videos at http://www.youtube.com/user/xXzman9000Xx

Rolina

#17
Search in the forum category for topics with similar names.  You'll see it.  There's also the whole explanation directly above your post as well.


Edit:  I've gone in and modified the previous posts in the thread to be Forum-neutral, so they no longer refer to GSAR-specific RP locations, and instead try only to refer to canon areas and terms for points of reference.  If I've missed something, please let me know.

Luna_blade

@Rolina: Thanks for the breeding explenation. I've had the subject a month or two ago, so I totally dig it.

First I was thinking about Ivan having a different mother/father, but if that's the case.

By the by, Saturos (user) was making a theory why Saturos has blue hair, so yeah...
"Hear the sounds and melodies
Of rilets flowing down
They're the verlasting songs
Whispering all the time
As a warning that behind some rocks
There's a rigid grap even
Oreads fear the tread"

Rolina

Easy answer is easy!  Because he was born with it!~ :awesomesmiley: